# Do Bottle Shows Depress You? Why?



## Arob (Apr 24, 2012)

Hi Guys its me Arob here, from Dumpdiggers
 I was wondering if anyone on here ever gets depressed after visiting big bottle shows? and seeing the collectibles for sale and realizing just how much or how little your own collection is actually worth? or perhaps even just how little your fav bottles are worth?... In my case its always much less than I thought possible. I used to believe that bottles would age and accrue more value over time... You know they are not making any more of them, but now... I wonder 

 I wrote about the 2012 Toronto Bottle show on Dumpdiggers blog. 





 I wrote a huge post, like ten pages and I realize now its because I find the whole thing slightly overwhelming. Here in Toronto the guys who make big bucks are the people who have day jobs digging holes in the ground for a living. Seriously. its the professional excavators and Toronto basement waterproofing contractors who are paid to dig holes all day that sell the most stuff at these shows - they have fistfulls of cash and its all profit cause whatever they find is just gravy on top of a good day job. No doubt they have big collections at home too. 




 At the show there was a guy selling all his milk bottles for $1 each. And halfway through the day he marked the remainder down to .50 cents each. I looked and as soon as I came across one that I owned already I had to stop looking...  I have about 250 ACL Ontario milks in storage - are they all worth 50 cents each?




 I guess the only thing more depressing would have been if there was nobody there to buy them...




 This jam jar sold for $15 ... and its the nicest jam jar label I have ever seen... why is it not worth $100? or a $1000 ?


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## tigue710 (Apr 24, 2012)

I love bottle shows, its such a great place to see whats out there, admire rare and expensive pieces I dont or can not own and get the chance to actually see them in person.  Theres always something for everyone when it comes to acquisitions also.  Where else can you go to hang out and socialize with hundreds of other collectors?  Bottles shows are awesome, for lack of a better word...  I think of them almost as like returning home after a long trip away somewhere...


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## TJSJHART (Apr 24, 2012)

THE ONLY THING THAT I GET DEPRESSED ABOUT AT SHOWS IS THAT SOME PEOPLE WANT WAY TO MUCH FOR  BOTTLES, BUT THAT CAN BE FIXED BY GOING THE LAST DAY AND THEY DON'T WANT TO HAUL IT HOME AND LOWER THE PRICES.. OR MY RUNNIN OUT OF FUNDS..AND THERE IS THE COLLECTIONS OF OTHER COLLECTORS THAT I'M JUST GREEN WITH ENVY FOR. LIKE THIS ONE..


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## botlguy (Apr 24, 2012)

Man,,,,,,,, this is SAD ! !   My thoughts as I read this are spinning. I am very reluctant to say what I'm really thinking so I won't. 

 Collect what you like regardless of cost, price, value, etc. If you're in it for the money O.K. but then it's like being in the stock market and letting your feelings be dictated by money. If the stock market is bullish you're HAPPY, if it's bearish you're SAD. "The love of money is the root of all evil." For me that is no way to live life. 

 I have a bottle worth $5,000 + but I don't care, I don't want to sell it. I have one that is worth $1.52 but I don't care, I like it A LOT. 

 If you are living your life correctly THINGS have little or no influence on you're feelings. ATTITUDE is the most important. I have lot's more if you want to hear it, this is not the place to discuss it.    P.M. me if you care to.     I care!


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## OsiaBoyce (Apr 24, 2012)

No, you seem to confuse 'collecting' w/ 'investing'.


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## botlguy (Apr 24, 2012)

> ORIGINAL:  OsiaBoyce
> 
> No, you seem toÂ confuse 'collecting' w/ 'investing'.


 Who does me (botlguy), or Arob?    I readily admit to being confused most of the time these days but I'm curious if you are referring to me on this one, especially noticing your signature. In your opinion am I a "wise man" or a "fool" ? I am not trying to start a fight or arguement, I simply want to know your opinion. I'm good either way.


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## OsiaBoyce (Apr 24, 2012)

personaquote]ORIGINAL: botlguy




> ORIGINAL: OsiaBoyce
> 
> No, you seem to confuse 'collecting' w/ 'investing'.


 Who does me (botlguy), or Arob? I readily admit to being confused most of the time these days but I'm curious if you are referring to me on this one, especially noticing your signature. In your opinion am I a "wise man" or a "fool" ? I am not trying to start a fight or arguement, I simply want to know your opinion. I'm good either way.
 [/quote] 

 I was answering the op.

 As far as the 'wise man' thing goes.......do you make a post every time there is a new post wether you know something about it  personally or not? 

 Ya see, having internet access does not make one a genius.


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## AntiqueMeds (Apr 24, 2012)

I used to tell people if they were just looking for investment , there were a lot better things than bottles, for instance art, coins, ..even the stock market (at least you get dividends).

 But, having said that, if you really enjoy the hobby and love glass, it isnt a bad thing spending money on bottles that you would have spent on eating out, new cars, or other items which hold no value. Someday the bottles will probably still be worth at least what you paid for them. Think of it as an alternate method of savings rather than an investment.
 The best advice I can give is buy quality over quantity and enjoy every hobby in moderation.

 If you dig your own bottles it isnt any different, you are still paying, in free time (which to me has great value).


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## botlguy (Apr 24, 2012)

> ORIGINAL:  OsiaBoyce
> As far as the 'wise man' thing goes.......do you make a post every time there is a new post wether you know something about itÂ  personally or not?
> Ya see, having internet access does not make one a genius.


 WOW! Consider me put in my place. Thank you, I was feeling lost.[&:][]


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## BillinMo (Apr 24, 2012)

I guess I have to ask the OP... why do you go to shows?  Is it just to see how much things are selling for?  

 Sure, I enjoy going to shows and adding a new piece to my collection or seeing rarities that I might never get a chance to see again. And I may even be annoyed if I see outrageous prices, or values fall on something I paid a lot for a few years ago. 

 But really, I'm there to see my friends and perhaps make new ones.  The stuff we collect is great, but in the end, it's just stuff.  You can't put a price on camaraderie, and that's what makes shows worthwhile.


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## RICKJJ59W (Apr 24, 2012)

I don't care if I don't buy a thing. I have fun at the 2  bottle shows I go to."Shupps Grove & Baltimore" It is about the people as much as it is about bottles.


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## Arob (Apr 24, 2012)

I go every year because of the camaraderie at the show.
 My own collection is junk - is that what you were thinking Botlguy? You're right. My stuff is all dug pieces and whatever i traded for... Toronto medicines mostly. I know that now because of the show. One good piece is worth more than six thousand hackers

 Honestly I have stopped collecting bottles BECAUSE I go to the the Toronto Bottle Show and I see old men trying to liquidate their collections and there are simply not a whole lot of buyers out there ...  

 I myself will probably never BUY another bottle again - for the most part, bottles are a terrible investment.   But not antiques are bad investments. I believe antique signs, brewerania, Coca cola, and crocks are a good purchases.  Poisons will always be okay, but beers, milks, medicines and sodas = who cares. 

 On Sunday I watched what sold at the Toronto show.  One dealer complained that he'd sold all his crates - he had to go to NoFrills and get newspapers and plastic bags to take his bottles home.  The wooden crates will sell before the bottles do !!!!  I see antique light fixtures, building ornaments, tableware even tin cans selling . Big crocks   this stuff has purpose and value. Furniture is utilitarian. Here in Toronto there is a big market for small items that fit into condominiums - small tables and matching wooden chairs, posters, rugs and Bakelite phones.   anyway  Im depressed because I have boxes and boxes of dug bottles in storage...  I think I'm going to bury them again.


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## OsiaBoyce (Apr 24, 2012)

> ORIGINAL: botlguy
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
 You are reading way to much into what I'm saying.........nothing is directed at you. Sorry if you feel it is a personal attack. I was speaking in vague generalities.


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## JustGlass (Apr 24, 2012)

I love to attend bottle shows. I see alot of bottles that I wouldn't see anywhere else in a life time and meet alot of great people that like the same thing I do. The bottle prices are usually out of this world and at times that can be depressing but with all those bottles and sellers there is always a good deal to be made. I go to four or five shows a year and find that it's not enough for me.


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## PrivyCheese (Apr 24, 2012)

I dont even have to go to shows to see bottles or collections better then mine. I have a friend who lives a half mile from me who has one of the best collections in town. Its all good. This isnt a competition. If you collect because of values your in the wrong hobby. There is always someone who has bigger and better. It is that way in life. 

   Collect what you like....period. One of the areas of bottles I collect are Baltimore Pharmacy/perscription bottles. You know how many people collect these......ONE....me. I have over 350 different ones. You think I will get rich? I do it because I like them. I have said it before...you cant take it with you. When we die we all have exactly the same.....zero! The only thing we leave this world with is the memories...Heck with the rest.


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## cowseatmaize (Apr 24, 2012)

Do I get depressed and sad. NEVER!! You aren't confusing that with jealousy and envy, are you?
 Jealousy and envy are totally useless emotions and I look inward and realize those feelings aren't beneficial. I feel very happy that I have a job and the ability to pay my rent, stay warm, eat, pay for the gas to get there in the first place etc.. I always manage to bring home a few cool to me items. If they cost $1.52, great!!! They usually cost a bit more but I stay within budget. That's what you got to do. I'm just fine with seeing all the great glass, at shows or right here.


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## ktbi (Apr 24, 2012)

I definitely do not get depressed.  Surprised sometimes, bored at others, but not depressed.  I have a great old Nevada Blob Top Soda (Henry Mau - rare) that I paid around $100 over value - wasn't real sure of value at the time, but I don't regret it at all. I love it and think it's cool (60's term there!) that it's in my collection.  If I was tightly focused on value, I would be kicking myself for paying so much. As it is now - Meh! (2010 term there!!) - just can't get worked up about value.  That doesn't mean I'm not keenly aware of value, it's just not a driving force. I have a couple of $70 - $80 bottles that I paid $1 for.  It balances in the end.

 For me, I get kind of tired of seeing the same bottles over and over again.  Always something new at every show, but many, many repeats.  I need to come back East for a show or two to see something different. I went to the Antioch show last weekend and the highlight of the day was talking to one dealer for 30-45 minutes.  That made my day, a new friend, and now another reason to look forward to the next show.

 From what I read here, I am going to have to make it to the Baltimore show sometime soon. Either that or Shupps Grove. I would love to meet a group of fellow forum members.  I'll buy lunch - you buy the beer.......Ron


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## TJSJHART (Apr 24, 2012)

BEING THAT YOU LIVE IN CALIFORNIA THERE ARE MEMBERS THAT LIVE THERE..TRY LOOKIN THEM UP IN THE MAP THAT THE FORUM HAS MADE .


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## cyberdigger (Apr 24, 2012)

making bottle friends is by far the best part of the hobby..!


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## RICKJJ59W (Apr 24, 2012)

Fiber makes me----sad


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## bottlekid76 (Apr 24, 2012)

Rob,

 I would have to disagree with you stating bottles are a bad investment. The bottles that you mentioned not being ok to collect, beers, milks, medicines, and sodas have a huge following in the bottle market. It sounds more like your preference as to what you like, and that's ok. We all collect different types of bottles, and if it was all about the money, this forum would probably be a ghost town. Sure, we all want our collection to have some monetary value, but as "collectors", it's the love of the glass, and the history associated with it that has us hooked. 

 Many types of antiques rise and fall in price, its just how the market performs. Trends, new collectors, older ones selling off, there is so much that plays into it. I can't even begin to scratch the surface. As with anything that someone collects, you have to really be into what it is that happens to be, to get the most enjoyment from it I believe. 

 Money wise, you have dealers and collectors, and folks that do a little of both. For me its a hobby, and one that i'd say i'm addicted to. I do it because I get enjoyment from antique bottles, that's really what it comes down to for me.

 I've seen some outstanding collections, and some are very valueable monetary wise, but when a friend of mine finds a bottle that i'd love to have, i'm really happy and excited for them. Would I have loved to have or found it? Sure I would, but i'm just as happy knowing they found that piece for their collection. Who knows, maybe I have somthing they are interested in to trade. There's so much to it. It's all fun. You can build alot of good friendships and knowledge in this hobby, but ultimately, you really gotta have a passion for it to get the most satisfaction from it.

 ~Tim


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## TJSJHART (Apr 24, 2012)

TRUE...SO TRUE TIM AKA BOTTLEKID76 . IN MY YOUNGER DAYS MY MOM AND DAD MOVED US BACK TO CINNY. NEWPORT AREA WHERE THEY GREW UP . I STARTED TO COLLECT FOSSILS ,TOTAL OF 79 GREAT PIECES, SOME FOUND  SOME BOUGHT. I STILL HAVE THAT COLLECTION. I EVEN HAVE A FEW STAR WAR PIECES. HOBBIES ?? YES AND I STILL ENJOY LOOKIN AT THEM MIXED WITH THE BOTTLES. IT'S ALL IN WHAT YOU LIKE ...AND AS MY WIFE SAYS'''WHAT I WON'T THROW OUT...OR GIVE AWAY . I TEND TO RAMBLE ON  A LOT .


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## Brains (Apr 24, 2012)

At bottle shows I usually get pretty worked up when i see some over priced insulators that i'd probably try to buy if i was a little less lazy.
 ..Now gun shows make me depressed


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## carobran (Apr 25, 2012)

> ORIGINAL: Brains
> 
> 
> Now gun shows make me depressed


 Just don't get _tooo_ depressed 

 As for bottle shows,well,I've only been to one,and it made me for from depressed.
 What does depress me is ebay,seeing bottles I thought I could make money on not selling for $.99

 Ok,now I'm getting tired of typing the word"depress(ed)"
 It depresses me ya know?


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## tigue710 (Apr 25, 2012)

Arob, are you saying the shows make you depressed because interest in bottles seems to be waning in Canada?


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## Plumbata (Apr 25, 2012)

Tend not to attend many bottle shows, but no, seeing all the goodies being offered which I can't afford is not upsetting. Yes, sometimes i wish I owned every darned object at the show, but that is just base greed talking. The guys selling the items are generally 2 or 3 times my age and have invested time I haven't even lived long enough to use in the pursuit of old glass. A neighbor and brilliant antiques/art dealer didn't even start until he was 26; older than me now. He has amazing stuff, granted, but I started when I was 5, and figure that when I'm a greying 58 year old like him I'll have a pretty awesome and highly diversified collection of old crap too. Wish i could have been born a decade earlier, before eBay killed so many of the potential steals out there, but I've done fine as it is. If I sold all my stuff I could buy a decent Middle-class house outright and have money to spare. Won't happen, but it is good to have that security in mind if unforeseen needs arise. Why be jealous of those who have invested thousands of hours into doing what they love and finding a way to profit from it?

 Perhaps part of it stems from one's focus on a single category. I have a decent local bottle collection and own some 1-of-a-kind TOC pieces, but when I encounter collectors with bottle collections worth several hundred K with many 1-of-a-kind pontiled/early pieces, it doesn't bother me. They are all older and largely in the twilight of their lives, and lack extensive collections/knowledge in other realms which I am highly invested within, realms which provide great joy and satisfaction. It is all about the love of the hobby, the love of collecting and sharing information, and the joys of meeting vibrant new people. These established collectors and dealers brought me into the hobby and helped to educate me. Sure, it was in their economic best interests if viewed cynically, but they are valuable resources in most respects and deserve the status they enjoy in the community. No one owns anything forever. It is all just stuff. We all die and rot away in our graves sooner or later, but the junk we have acted as stewards over will live on and educate new generations of appreciators long after we are transformed into worm food. That is the viewpoint I've always held. We rescue from the ground or curbside garbage piles what others have deemed as worthless, and resurrect them into something worth preserving for those who come after us. A noble cause in it's own right; regardless of associated prices or values in a particular year.


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## botlguy (Apr 25, 2012)

> ORIGINAL:  Plumbata
> 
> Tend not to attend many bottle shows, but no, seeing all the goodies being offered which I can't afford is not upsetting. Yes, sometimes i wish I owned every darned object at the show, but that is just base greed talking. The guys selling the items are generally 2 or 3 times my age and have invested time I haven't even lived long enough to use in the pursuit of old glass. A neighbor and brilliant antiques/art dealer didn't even start until he was 26; older than me now. He has amazing stuff, granted, but I started when I was 5, and figure that when I'm a greying 58 year old like him I'll have a pretty awesome and highly diversified collection of old crap too. Wish i could have been born a decade earlier, before eBay killed so many of the potential steals out there, but I've done fine as it is. If I sold all my stuff I could buy a decent Middle-class house outright and have money to spare. Won't happen, but it is good to have that security in mind if unforeseen needs arise. Why be jealous of those who have invested thousands of hours into doing what they love and finding a way to profit from it?
> 
> Perhaps part of it stems from one's focus on a single category. I have a decent local bottle collection and own some 1-of-a-kind TOC pieces, but when I encounter collectors with bottle collections worth several hundred K with many 1-of-a-kind pontiled/early pieces, it doesn't bother me. They are all older and largely in the twilight of their lives, and lack extensive collections/knowledge in other realms which I am highly invested within, realms which provide great joy and satisfaction. It is all about the love of the hobby, the love of collecting and sharing information, and the joys of meeting vibrant new people. These established collectors and dealers brought me into the hobby and helped to educate me. Sure, it was in their economic best interests if viewed cynically, but they are valuable resources in most respects and deserve the status they enjoy in the community. No one owns anything forever. It is all just stuff. We all die and rot away in our graves sooner or later, but the junk we have acted as stewards over will live on and educate new generations of appreciators long after we are transformed into worm food. That is the viewpoint I've always held. We rescue from the ground or curbside garbage piles what others have deemed as worthless, and resurrect them into something worth preserving for those who come after us. A noble cause in it's own right; regardless of associated prices or values in a particular year.


 I tried to delete some of the above post for bandwidth economy reasons but could not bring myself to do it. Well said Stephen / Plumbata. I am much older than many / most of you and it is somewhat disappointing that most / many of you do not appreciate the fact that the hobby you enjoy had foundations upon which todays hobby was built. I, for one and Red Mathews and perhaps others on this forum, am / are some of the pioneers of this hobby. We get little to no respect from many / most of you. I am not complaining but this seems to be typical of the younger generation. You seem to have no interest in history. Many of the terms you take for granted were coined back in the 1960s which I was part of. 

 I have had more valueable, desireable bottles go through my hands than most of you could ever hope to own. Am I better than you? Not even a little bit ! More fortunate? Probably ! My point is: Listen, learn and be respectful. I have parted with collections that would rival the best on this forum from a monetary viewpoint (there are definite exceptions). The money was spent on more noble ventures. There are more inportant things in life than empty bottles. The point of this rant is a reminder to keep this hobby in perspective, there are more inportant things in life than old, empty bottles. 

 Please excuse this rant if you are somehow offended, actually, I don't give a rip. Sometimes I just have to vent which most of you ignore. Good choice. I mean no harm.


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## andy volkerts (Apr 25, 2012)

[] Somebody said and I dont know who, but it is true, we are just stewards of the past nothing more, when ya die if your lucky your bottles will find another steward who loves em as well as you do, but in the now, just enjoy em no matter what category they fall in..........


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## andy volkerts (Apr 25, 2012)

> ORIGINAL:  RICKJJ59W
> 
> Fiber makes me----sad


 BWAHAAHAHAHAH.......[][][][][][][]


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## RICKJJ59W (Apr 25, 2012)

> ORIGINAL:  botlguy
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 

 The question is--------did you ever have a puce Eagle l[8D][8D]


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## botlguy (Apr 25, 2012)

[/quote]


 The question is--------did you ever have a puce Eagle l[8D][8D]
 [/quote]
 Now ya got me. No, darn it. If I had ever had one I would still have it. I think the best flask I have is a quart Corset Waisted Scroll. My best bottle, ever, is my HARKNESS FIRE GRENADE in a Peacock / Sapphire / Cobalt sort of blue with profuse Pigeon Blood Red swirls throughout, in pristine condition. But, like I've said before, value doesn't necessarily dictate my favorites.


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## imukdiver (Apr 25, 2012)

I don't get depressed, just a lil frustrated. People seem to think that there is only a already set bottle supply. They need to think that every year more of every type of bottle are being dug out of the ground. I'd even hazard to say that almost all types of bottles are becoming more common. Though true some will always be rare, some rare ones will become common. It never ceases to amaze me at bottles shows all the time. You see 20 or so dealers all with several examples of the exact same bottle. Yet they all have their prices in the few hundered dollar range. At this point the once rare bottle should be considered common and prices adjust accordingly. LOL. I would say 99.9 % of bottles are never going to be a good investment, just a good hobby. []


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## blobbottlebob (Apr 25, 2012)

Nice discussion. I only attend one bottle show a year. I look forward to it for months. I love seeing all of the people who are as nutty for bottles as I am. Plus, you can meet authors, hear stories, make friends as well as enjoy the old glass. I love to wind somebody up about something that they are passionate about and to listen and learn.


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## Stardust (Apr 25, 2012)

no [] 
 i
 love
 them ~   *


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## RIBottleguy (Apr 25, 2012)

Touching on the milks you mentioned, I'd say common milks go for $5-10 (excluding ones like Hoods).  If I saw those milks around here (and they were locals), I would have bought him out and made a killing selling them off.  Sometimes high end collectors don't mind taking a loss on bottles that they see as taking up space, even though they might be nice ones, just not $100+ nice.


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