# 7up 'White Swimsuit Girl' bottle



## iggyworf (Jan 16, 2020)

I recently got another 'white swimsuit girl' 7up bottle. I got this one off the internet and I don't think the person knew how rare it was. Now this bottle as well as the 'orange swimsuit girl' bottle(which I do not own one) have been discussed a lot before. I will post links to those posts.
This one differs from my other one in that it has '7up' embossed once on the neck as well as one 8 bubble acl on the neck. It has 'THE JOYCE PRODUCTS COMPANY...COLUMBUS OHIO' embossed along the heel of the bottle and is made by the 'Reed Glass Co' of Rochester NY. R ind a triangle on the bottom with a 5 and a 7 also. Not sure how to date Reed bottles. The other is Owens Illinois bottle.
Both of my bottles do not have the 'pips' on the heel to keep the bottle in position for the ACL printing. Both bottles has the ACL printed over the seem line on the body of the bottle. The seem almost cuts the swimsuit girl in half. They are both 7oz and have the same back label.
My first one is Owens Illinois and is from 1936, but this one has to be earlier I think because of the embossing on the neck and heel. How much earlier? Not sure.
























						7up 8 bubble John G Epping 1941 & White swimsuit girl 1936
					

Here are the bottles I promised to post. 1st is the 8 bubble John G. Epping from 1941. I did basic cleaning but this one still has some cloudiness in it.    2nd is the special one a coworker got me at a garage sale. A 8 bubble white swimsuit girl. From the Downey-Joyce 7up co. Norwalk - Ohio -...



					www.antique-bottles.net
				









						Orange swimsuit bubble girl 7up
					

Label is much more greyed out/faded. It's a very unusual bottle embossed on one side with an 8 bubble ACL neck label on the other.   I think it's a 1937.



					www.antique-bottles.net
				









						Some unusual 8 bubble 7 Up bottles
					

I have been doing some research on the early 7 Up bottles since I bought these four bottles a few days ago and have discovered that all 3 variations I have are rather unsual 8 bubble 7 Up bottles according to what I read in the Soda Fizz articles by Bill Lockhart...



					www.antique-bottles.net
				




Thanx for lookin.  And I have another rare 7up bottle that I will be posting soon. got this one with the help of Sodabob aka SodapopBob


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## WesternPA-collector (Jan 16, 2020)

Nice bottle. Thanks for  sharing the info about it too. I hardly know anything about Reed Glass. If I find anything I will let you know.


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## RCO (Jan 17, 2020)

all the 7 up swim  bottles I have , the lady is white , or was there something else unusual about this one ? the neck is embossed which is much less common .

is so many 7 up bottles , that's likely why the seller wasn't aware it was uncommon


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## iggyworf (Jan 17, 2020)

RCO said:


> all the 7 up swim  bottles I have , the lady is white , or was there something else unusual about this one ? the neck is embossed which is much less common .
> 
> is so many 7 up bottles , that's likely why the seller wasn't aware it was uncommon



Just happen to be online at the same time. Hey RCO, the ones you have, is the actual bathing suit white or just her arms and legs. Please check and post some pics. Because the American versions of this bottle are rare.


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## iggyworf (Jan 17, 2020)

comparison pic of swimsuit color




regular swimsuit................................................................white swimsuit


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## RCO (Jan 17, 2020)

iggyworf said:


> Just happen to be online at the same time. Hey RCO, the ones you have, is the actual bathing suit white or just her arms and legs. Please check and post some pics. Because the American versions of this bottle are rare.



doesn't seem to be any paint on the swim suit portion , they look like the regular swim , now I see whats different about your bottle


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## Eric (Jan 17, 2020)

Congrats on the addition! Great bottle! Looks like a very old one due to the paint/logo application and logo... nice find for sure!


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## NBM (Jan 22, 2020)

Don't know if you'll find this helpful, but according to _Bottle Makers and Their Marks _by Julian Harrison Toulouse, Reed Glass Co. used that maker's mark from 1927-1956.


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## iggyworf (Jan 22, 2020)

Thanx NBM and everyone else. I believe this bottle to be from 1937 then.


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## Burkenhill (Jan 22, 2020)

iggyworf said:


> I recently got another 'white swimsuit girl' 7up bottle. I got this one off the internet and I don't think the person knew how rare it was. Now this bottle as well as the 'orange swimsuit girl' bottle(which I do not own one) have been discussed a lot before. I will post links to those posts.
> This one differs from my other one in that it has '7up' embossed once on the neck as well as one 8 bubble acl on the neck. It has 'THE JOYCE PRODUCTS COMPANY...COLUMBUS OHIO' embossed along the heel of the bottle and is made by the 'Reed Glass Co' of Rochester NY. R ind a triangle on the bottom with a 5 and a 7 also. Not sure how to date Reed bottles. The other is Owens Illinois bottle.
> Both of my bottles do not have the 'pips' on the heel to keep the bottle in position for the ACL printing. Both bottles has the ACL printed over the seem line on the body of the bottle. The seem almost cuts the swimsuit girl in half. They are both 7oz and have the same back label.
> My first one is Owens Illinois and is from 1936, but this one has to be earlier I think because of the embossing on the neck and heel. How much earlier? Not sure.
> ...




Thank you for showing us and telling us about this unusual bottle.  As soon as I read your post I went and checked through all my 7up swimsuit lady bottles and I do not have any with the "white swimsuit girl", as you described it.  In my humble opinion your bottle is not pre-1936 for a few reasons.  It would seem that either Reed Glass or Owens Illinois or Joyce Product Company went outside the 7up logo standardization requirements to have coloured in the swim suit with ACL white.  

Firstly,  on the earliest paper label  7up bottles, there was the  silhouette drawing of the “slenderizing” lady or “bubble girl” – a silhouette of a young woman with arms up-stretched and the word “Slenderizing” across her legs.  In the silhouette of the slenderizing lady, she was shown with only 1 foot and the early ACL bottles also had only 1 foot showing.  From all my 7up bottles, 7up had included the 2nd foot on the swim lady from some time in 1938 and onward.  Your swim lady has 2 feet showing so I'm certain it fits more like as a 1938 or later bottle.
Secondly, on 7up bottles, the first shoulder embossing originally had a "u7p".  Some time later it was changed to the more intuitive "7up" embossing to be in line with and consistent with the normal 7up logo.  Any 1936 bottles I have show the "u7p" neck embossing and the first instances I have of the "7up" neck embossing start with 1937 bottles.   

Thirdly, the back label on your bottle is a  " 1a" according to Bill Lockhart's extensive research, much of which he provided in his Sodafizz articles.  His work suggests that the earliest a 1a label appeared was in 1939 as shown on the attached excerpt from one of his articles.  The difference in the 1a back label which came after label 1 was the words on the back label which were changed from the earlier label that stated, "For the Stomach's sake, do not shake or stir" to the later, easier reading version that stated, "For the Stomach's sake, do not stir or shake".

I hope that helps you in dating your very special bottle.

Rick Burfoot


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## iggyworf (Jan 24, 2020)

Burkenhill, thanx for you input. I know that 7up table well. Unfortunately it is getting old. We have found many bottles that don't adhere to that list. The 'Slenderizing Lady' on the PL bottles was never used on the ACL versions. It was streamed down to the 'Swimsuit' girl as we call it, as you already know. I know about the one foot vs two feet, although I am not sure what yr they stopped the one ft bottles. but I think some have been found in the later yrs of the 1930's.

I also am pretty sure that the embossed 'U7P' has been found on bottles as late as 1945. I will have to look in my files to see if I have any pics.

My first '"white swimsuit' bottle is clearly a 1936 bottle as the Owens mark on the bottom states. Made at the Alton Il plant as designated by the 7 then the Owens Ill mark and then a 6 for 1936.
Most 7up bottles  follow that back label chart as well, but again variations have been found.

I do understand that certain companies may have not followed the '7up' standards to the letter as in these 'white swimsuit' bottles.(don't forget the orange one also)  Also the '3-1-3' bubble pattern on two of my Los Angeles bottles.(that is another thread though)(actually after double checking my two '3-1-3' bottles, they are both 'one foot' and both from 1941 according to the Owens date codes on the bottom)Wow! I under looked that before.

I don't know much on the dating of 'Reed' glass bottles. But some of us speculate the 7 would be 1937. If so then my unembossed bottle is older than the embossed one. Hmmmm? lol

So these bottles are definately a mystery. If we can find more info on how to date 'Reed' glass bottles that would help a lot. Thanx for any interest and info from you or anyone else as I am not an expert on these bottles. But it is enjoyable to discuss these things!


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## shotdwn (Jan 24, 2020)

Great information iggyworf. It seems to be a never ending task to sort out time lines on 7up bottles.


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## iggyworf (Jan 24, 2020)

Thanx shotdown! Yeah it sure is(as with many other brands as well). And it's not like we can find people who worked at these places anymore either.lol But it is fun!


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## Canadacan (Jan 29, 2020)

Hey cool find!...and congrats. Information is at a premium!....but having that article as a guide sure helps!...BTW the u7p was embossed on Canadian quart necks till at least 1945,  not sure how late they used it in the USA.


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## SODABOB (Jan 29, 2020)

iggy / Rich

Great bottle (as usual)  I have been doing some research, but before I continue I need to know where the embossed 5 and 7 are located on the base.  I can't make them out in the picture you posted.  The location of the numbers could be a major factor in properly dating your bottle.  

Thanks

Bob


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## iggyworf (Jan 29, 2020)

Hey Bob! Always grateful for your help. In the pic 5 on left 7 on right.


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## iggyworf (Jan 29, 2020)

Thanx Canadacan! I still am pretty sure there are 1945 'U7P' embossed bottles in US.


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## SODABOB (Jan 29, 2020)

Thanks Rich - Are the numbers on either side of the R-Triangle or elsewhere?


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## iggyworf (Jan 29, 2020)

They are below the triangle.


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## SODABOB (Jan 29, 2020)

Thanks, Rich

The location of the numbers changes things slightly, but not dramatically.  The reason I say that is because most of the Reed Glass Company bottles I'm familiar with that used the R-Triangle mark have the numbers on either side of the mark such as the one I'm attaching from the Unatin 7-UP Company, Beaver Falls, Pa. Notice the number 1 on the left and the number 6 on the right.  However, the number 6 doesn't necessarily mean it was made in 1936 - although I personally believe that it WAS made in 1936. But proving it is another thing.  Probably the most extensive article ever published about the Reed Glass Company was compiled by Bill Lockhart and the Bottle Research Group (BRG).

Here's the link ...



			https://sha.org/bottle/pdffiles/FEReed.pdf
		


The R-Triangle part starts on Page 18.  But even it is a little vague about how to date bottles with that particular mark.  ( By the way, I am now a member of the BRG and was invited to join by Bill Lockhart and the other members about a year ago )

So, what I have been looking at to help narrow down the dates is ...

1. When was the Joyce Products Company in Columbus, Ohio established? = Possibly as early as 1933, but definitely by 1934.  They no doubt used paper labels at first (1933-34) and then adopted ACL later.

2. When was the Unatin 7-UP Company in Beaver Falls, Pennsylvania established?  =  1935 according to numerous sources.

Although more research is required to confirm the date for the White Swimsuit 7-UP bottle, we at least know that the two 7-UP companies referred to here (Joyce and Unatin) were both in operation at least as early as 1934 and 1935, and that a possible 1935 or 1937 date for the White Swimsuit bottle is not out of the realm of possibilities ... 

















Joyce Products Company Newspaper Article ~ October 3, 1934 ~ Earliest I was able to find (Click to open)


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## SODABOB (Jan 29, 2020)

I have been doing a little more poking around and the latest date I can find for the Unatin 7up Company is 1945.  If that was when the company ceased operating, then it is highly unlikely that the 6 next to the Reed mark is for 1946 - which presents and even greater possibility for the 6 as representing 1936.  In case you are wondering why I am focusing on the Unatin 7up bottle, its because I believe if we can date it with some measure of accuracy, then the same might apply to dating Rich's White Swimsuit bottle.  I acknowledge that more research is required, but sometimes by looking outside the box is where some of the best information can be found.  I hate to guess about such things, but if I were to guess, I would lean toward Rich's bottle as having been made in 1937 and the Unatin bottle in 1936  (With "maybe" as my escape clause)


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## iggyworf (Jan 29, 2020)

In my limited search's of Unitan, they seemed to have had a few legal problems. So they latest of 1945 could be correct.










						Unatin 7-Up Co., Inc. v. Solomon, 39 A.2d 835, 350 Pa. 632 – CourtListener.com
					

Unatin 7-Up Co., Inc. v. Solomon — Brought to you by Free Law Project, a non-profit dedicated to creating high quality open legal information.




					www.courtlistener.com
				












						UNATIN 7 UP COMPANY v. CO | 1 T.C.M. 170 (1942) | ftcm1701114 | Leagle.com
					

Memorandum Findings of Fact and Opinion DISNEY J. This proceeding involves a redetermination of a deficiency in excess profits tax...ftcm1701114




					www.leagle.com
				




I havn't read thru these completely but the Co. had a few probs. Not sure if these relate to an early closing of the plant.

Let's not forget Jbeas31 orange swimsuit bottle.





1937?


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## SODABOB (Jan 29, 2020)

Back at ya, Rich.  I was looking at jbeas31's Orange Swimsuit bottle earlier today and realized I didn't have a picture of the base -- but now, thanks to you, I do.  I had forgotten it was a Reed bottle. If you look close at the bottom on the the back of the bottle, you will see PRODUCTS CO  - which, if my memory serves me correctly, is for the JOYCE PRODUCTS CO  -- Also notice on the base where it has a 7 like your's, but instead of a 5 on the left, jbeas31's bottle has a 4  -- With the common denominator being the 7 -- which I will bet dimes to donuts is for ...

*1937







*


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## Jbeas31 (Jan 29, 2020)

Nice bottle, Iggy. Been a while since I’ve been on. 
I believe I have the same bottle you have except mine doesn’t have a makers mark. Only thing I believe I see on the bottom is a faint “7“ .


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## SODABOB (Jan 30, 2020)

Hi, jbeas31.  

Long time no see. But I guess the same can be said for me.  I used to be on here 24/7 but have been busy lately with some other stuff.  Thanks for sharing your bottle - its a beaut and maybe one of these days I will find one for myself.  Your orange swimsuit bottle is a goody, too.  I suppose we can't say for certain just yet, but most of the indicators seem to point to these bottles as having been made in 1937.  I just wish there was a definitive way to date Reed bottles.  As I mentioned earlier, I am a member of the Bottle Research Group now, and even they are not 100% certain about how to accurately dating the R-Triangle mark.  But even with that said, I think the recurrence of the number 7 is more than a coincidence and that it could very well be for 1937.  As far as the other numbers are concerned, such as the 4 and the 5 on the left side of the mark, I'm thinking those could very well be month codes.  Bottle makers didn't put those kind of numbers on bottles for no reason, with most if not all of them intended for some type of quality control and/or tracking.  

Take care,

Bob


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## DFW Digger (Apr 13, 2020)

Kinda confused on this info. Could someone help dating these two. Sodabob, I wondered if you were the sodapopbob from yrs ago, took a break from bottle hunting. These were surface finds that I stuck caps on. Thanks for any help. I will be posting more texas sodas soon stuff I found within the last month. The Cuero is the owen Illinois mark with lithia. Also they changed Soda citrate to sodium citrate.


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## SODABOB (Apr 13, 2020)

DFW

I got a notification about your post because I am subscribed to this thread.  Yes, I am the same Sodapopbob, but switched to Sodabob when I created a new, personal email address a few years ago.

Your first bottle was made by Owens Illinois in 1943.  Any base embossing with the word Durglas was made in 1940 or later. Duraglas was glass hardening treatment that was introduced in 1940.  The texturing, or "Stippling" as the industry refers to it, was also introduced around 1940.  The purpose of the stippling was twofold … (1) to allow air to flow beneath a hot bottle so it would cool and set faster … (2) to better stabilize it on conveyor belts.

Even though your second bottle does not have the word Duraglas or Stippling, the 0 (zero) indicates it was made in 1940.  I can't say for certain based on your pic, but there should be an embossed Dot to the right of the 0 (zero).   Those dots are ONLY found on soda bottles made by Owens Illinois and came later to distinguish the difference between bottles made in 1930 and those that were made in 1940.  The dots also appear on bottles made throughout the 1940s and was eliminated in the late 1940s and early 1950s when Owens Illinois switched to double-digit date codes such as 55 for 1955.

Another thing to note is that the ACL process (Applied Color Label) was first used by Owens Illinois in 1934. So all ACL bottles were made in 1934 or later.

Additionally, the 3 on the left side of the Owens Illinois logo 3<(I)>3 indicates it was made at O-I plant No. 3 located in Fairmont, West Virginia.

In conclusion, it may interest you to know that I occupy a lot of my time these days with research.  Last fall, Bill Lockhart and I, with contributions by Chris Weide and Russ Hoenig, published an article titled ...

"The Glamorous Applied Color Labels"

It can be found via the following links, and covers a lot of the information just discussed ...


This link is via the sha.org website = The link to the article is next to the photo of the Mission Beverages bottle in the paragraph that starts with Note:

https://sha.org/bottle/glossary.htm


This link goes directly to the PDF and bypasses the sha.org website

https://sha.org/bottle/pdffiles/ACLArticle2019.pdf

Thanks for sharing your bottles - I hope my information was helpful and you enjoy the ACL article

Bob


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## SODABOB (Apr 13, 2020)

P.S.

Here are a couple of Bill Lockhart articles that specifically focus on 7up bottles, and contain a lot of helpful information ...

2005

https://sha.org/bottle/pdffiles/BLockhart_7UpBottlers.pdf

2010

https://sha.org/bottle/pdffiles/EPChap10b.pdf


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## DFW Digger (Apr 13, 2020)

Thank u for your help in this . seems I remember u being the go to guy 10 yrs ago. You ,red Mathews cyberdigger and capsoda. Helped me a lot in this passion. Thanks again.


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## SODABOB (Apr 13, 2020)

Your welcome and thanks

Bill Lockhart and I are currently working on another soda bottle related article that we hope to publish in the near future - which means this coming summer and will share a link to it on this thread after its published


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## StevenF (Jun 3, 2020)

SODABOB said:


> Your welcome and thanks
> 
> Bill Lockhart and I are currently working on another soda bottle related article that we hope to publish in the near future - which means this coming summer and will share a link to it on this thread after its published


My great grandfather was the owner of the Unitan bottling co.  I can probably answer any questions you may have.


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## iggyworf (Jun 3, 2020)

Steve welcome. Very cool about your grandfather. I am sure we will come up with some questions soon. Thanx!


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## Bottleluver (Jan 18, 2021)

I have a 7up bottle also not looking to sell just found it no clear markings this is the best I have anyone know a year? Ish


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## iggyworf (Jan 28, 2021)

Look at the bottom of the bottle for any markings. That bottle has seen better days.


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## Bottleluver (Jan 28, 2021)

thanks it has I found it at an old dump


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