# Cleaning my way, what the heck



## LaidBackJack (Aug 10, 2004)

Hey, I'm just a country boy I gotta make do with what's on hand.  In the spirit of Edison, I have tried most everything imaginable...  at one time or another, trying to clean up dug/dirty bottles. Carburetor cleaner works great, too great in fact.  Same thing with Berryman's B12 Chemtool. Paint remover, Acetone, Lacquer Thinner, Zylol, etc  I've tried them all. Not having a polisher, or knowing anyone with one, I've settled on hand methods of trying to improve some bottle's cosmetic qualities. For primary inside cleaning I use copper pellets cut from old electrical cable...pretty standard treatment I guess. Vinegar sometimes. Let it sit for awhile, then shake the thing for 15 minutes while watching the news or something. But the thing I'm using now, that works the best after the bottle is clean & I'm faced with discoloration or stains on the glass....... is Naval Jelly & Silicone Spray.. The Naval Jelly will definitely remove any iron or mineral stains, and doesn't attack the glass. It even seems to soften some of those iridescent discolorations that dug bottles will get. On some bottles, the Naval Jelly is miraculous, but it won't help scratched or opaqued glass. I let the Jelly sit thick on the glass for 24-48 hours before washing & scrubbing clean. Then when it's completely clean & dry, spray inside & out with Silicone spray lubricant....available at most any hardware store.  I let the silicone sit on there for a while as well, and swish it around the inside...but then I wipe it & buff it, & the result is always way better than it started out.  The silicone spray is far superior to mineral oil, AFAIC for glossing up bottles.  Perhaps I have deluded myself, or maybe sniffed too many different chemical fumes trying to find the right  stuff....but I'm convinced that these two ingredients have improved many of my bottles & at little cost & labor....better & more reliably than anything else I have tried so far.  I really don't like polished bottles, and quite often just a moderate improvement in visual condition makes a bottle dramatically more interesting & attractive to me. I'll continue to experiment, but for now any bottle I want to try & upgrade gets this treatment.  I wonder if anyone else has used these products for this purpose?


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## Tandy (Aug 10, 2004)

[] LaidBackJack, welcome to the forum. I am pleased to see that finally someone has mentioned Naval Jelly. From memory, it contains phosphoric acid, and is very good for removing iron stains on stoneware. Your methods used are well worth remembering, Naval Jelly works really well. As it is not a "strong" acid like Hydrochloric, there is less washing off afterwards.[]

 Some of the extremely fine carborundum powders used in polishing stones can be useful in cleaning and/or polishing imperfections on glass.


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## IRISH (Aug 10, 2004)

Hi LaidBackJack, welcome to the forum [] .

 Naval jelly is indeed Phosphoric Acid,  I can't find it for sale here anywhere though [&o] .  I use pure phosphoric acid diluted with water for spot cleaning rust off stoneware but it is a bit runny to stick to it, I try to avoid soaking stone in it as it's too hard to get it all out.
 I've been using Phosphoric this week to clean my glass bottles too as I've run out of Hydrochloric Acid [] , as LaidBackJack say's it makes an exellent job of it it's just more expensive.


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## LaidBackJack (Aug 10, 2004)

Tandy & Irish, g'day mates. (If you're Sheilas, pardon me but g'day all the same)Thanks for the welcome, this is a great forum for a person like myself who has more questions than answers. There are definitely a lot of regular posters here who really know their stuff, & are sharing their knowledge. What a great place to learn more about my glass addiction. I guess it figures that Ozzies would already know about my Naval Jelly treatment, right? And you can't even buy any downunder! Man, I bet you have some secret recipe like pit-viper venom & beetle shells that makes bottles look like new every time.... I just go to Orchard Supply Hardware & buy NJ a gallon at a time for about $18. One gallon will do hundreds of bottles. I've used straight phosphoric acid solutions to de-rust old beercans & metal toys etc. It works OK, but it's also very easy to use it too long or too strong, & then you can ruin your prized old cone-top. Plus you have a big tub of caustic liquid to deal with. I like the Naval Jelly because you can just paint it on with a brush, & it sticks to the glass, even on vertical surfaces. So far I've never noticed any damage from using it ...even left on for a couple days. I wouldn't try it on an ACL bottle, for sure. It washes off with water easily enough, and I've treated some bottles over & over again until I couldn't perceive (or imagine) any more improvement.  Now I'm thinking that Coca-Cola is full of phosphoric acid, and can be used in a pinch for removing rust...so I suppose a coke bath might even be similarly beneficial if someone wanted to go with the slow route. I think I'll try it, just for experimental purposes, on some "targets" I keep around just for potentially destructive tests. Where I live, there's lots of iron in the soil, & most dug bottles that have been in the ground for decades will be iron-stained...that's how I came to try the Naval Jelly in the first place. The thing is, that it can also cause some improvement of other types of discoloration or stain. Even the iridescent sheen that long buried bottles will get can be effected, sometimes considerably. Of course a really badly afflicted bottle isn't going to be helped much, but the mildly affected examples can be significantly upgraded. Nothing else I've tried, short of actual polishing has done as much.  The combo of NJ & then silicone seems to work together better than either one by itself. If you get a chance, try the silicone spray lubricant treatment, & see what you think about that. The only downside to the silicone is that it will make your bottles slicker & slippier than a greased hog once they're sprayed, and they will literally squirt out of your hands when wet if you aren't real carefull. I always do the silicone bit over a pile of old blankets & pillows...just in case. Do you know why silicone would make such a good "glosser" for glass? All I can figure is that after the carrier evaporates away, a micro-thin clear film is left behind that covers & reduces the light-scattering caused by stains & discoloration on the glass surface? Unlike mineral oil, or other substances I have used, the effects seem to be permanent, & there's no organic content to yellow or get rancid & require periodic cleaning & re-application.  Once coated with the stuff, and allowed to dry, you don't need to wash or re-apply ....you just polish with a soft rag & the bottle looks as before. Hey, if you know about the Naval Jelly, you probably already know about the silicone as well.


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## IRISH (Aug 10, 2004)

Nope never even thought about using silicone oil [] , makes good sense though that it would work for the exact reason you posted above.  I will have to try it on some of the bottles that are waiting for a polish [] .


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## LaidBackJack (Aug 10, 2004)

Irish, please do give it a try out, & eventually tell me honestly that I'm nuts!   Or not.  Seriously, I don't think the silicone alters anything with the glass, but my guess is that it changes the refractive qualities of the glass, & lessens the visual contrast made by any existing stains or discolorations. Not always dramatic, but more often than not it's noticeable with the Mark I eyeball, & that's all I care about. The best thing is that it's maintenence-free & virtully permanent. That's why I think the silicone leaves behind a thin, durable film, which is what slightly alters the refractive index & causes the noticeable positive results.  Hey, it's a theory.... and a guy needs a hobby.  If others tried it, & found it to be a usefull technique as well....I'd be happy as a clam!  More beautiful glass! What could be better? Thanks for the input...

 Frank (otherwise known as LBJ)


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## diginit (Aug 11, 2004)

Think I'll try it too. It's funny you should mention coke a cola as a cleaner. It cleans copper very well also. Put a penny in some and find out. It will also etch concrete so don't spill it in the garage. Gotta go, I'm thirsty.


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## LaidBackJack (Aug 11, 2004)

Once upon a time, in  1976, I bought this quart bottle of coke, & that night I quaffed it ...sans glass, laying on my couch & watching "The Untouchables" on channel 2 @ 11:00 PM. After I'd downed about 2/3 of the bottle, I noticed a rattling when I tipped it up....and I simultaneously became aware of a foul metallic kind of taste in my mouth.  When I sat up, turned on the light.. & examined the coke bottle, I discovered that it contained an old, corroded plastic toothbrush!!!!  in addition to the so-called Coca-Cola beverage I had been mindlessly drinking. The foul thing had been in there a couple months, by the bottling date,  & was half disintigrated away. And I had just swilled 2/3 of that goop.  I about puked, but I managed to not gag, &  immediately next morning I got in touch with Coca-Cola Co./Fremont  & described my experience to some phone flunky.. Well, A guy came out, the same day...navy blue Ford LTD-FBI-mobile. It was either the FBI, or it was gonna be the Jehovahs Witnesses again with that rig. There was a big bottling plant in Fremont about 10 miles away & the bottle in question had come from it,  thus the instant response. The company guy wanted that bottle bad...after I showed it to him, with the cratered stubb of a plastic toothbrush floating around in the cola-colored chemical goo.  He quickly went around & opened his trunk & started trying to establish my price.  I should have held out for more, but I was young then. Immediate gratification. Practicality...I wasn't dead or even sick.  But I did get all the four cases of Coke that he had in the trunk, and a big handfull of coupons worth 1/2 off on any Coke products, whoopee!  As soon as he had the offensive bottle in his mitts, he mellows out a little & tells me how he and the rest of his Coca-Cola G-Men were all hot on the trail of the commie-pinko who had been sabotaging their Fremont Plant.  So I wasn't the only one, apparently. I sold the Cokes & coupons to Terry next door, and I have never once in the 28 years since....imbimbed Coke or any other carbonated sody-pop for that matter. Water, Beer, Fruit juice, Iced Tea, Coffee, Booze....but no Coke.  I will, however,  happily employ it for it's actual best use, which is corrosion. Take it from me, the stuff is poison. You put metal in beer & it will grow fungus. Put it in Coke & it will slowly dissolve away.


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## Tandy (Aug 11, 2004)

[] Hi there Frank,
                              Thanks for the accolades, I appreciate it, and I'm sure Irish does too!  

 As for me, Irish's post reminded me that, like him, I have not actually been able to find any Naval Jelly lately, but I must confess that I have not actually been looking for iot. I'll check the local hardware shop soon. I'm not even sure if I can get Phosphoric acid in solution either.[]

 [8|] An idea that a lot of diggers/collectors use to make a slightly sick bottle look good is to rub Goanna Oil onto the surface. I have been told that any oil will do the same thing, but don't use the heavier oils like olive oil or castor oil, as they tend to be sticky. In the same way, I guess using a light or very light oil might not work, as they may evaporate too quickly.[8|]

 [] I like the idea of using copper pellets to polish the insides of bottles, as copper pellets are softer than glass, they do not scratch. []

 As a matter of interest, has anyone ever used Sodium meta bi-sulphite to clean the insides of bottles? The substance is the main ingredient of toilet cleaners, such as Harpic.


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## LaidBackJack (Aug 11, 2004)

So what is Goanna Oil? Never heard of it. I have tried Tea Tree Oil, BTW & it works fine but too expensive & rather aromatic. Using organic oils invariably requires re-washing & re-application of the oil. I suppose it's less of a problem in more controlled environments than I deal with.....I live in an arid, dusty, either hot or wet type zone. Mineral oil on a displayed bottle, & a month later it needs re-doing from all the dust & grunge. The silicone doesn't leave behind a sticky surface to  catch floating dust particles. When you decide to clean up a displayed bottle all you have to do is use a soft cloth & wipe the bottle clean,  grunge won't stick to the bottle. It's like teflon with the silicone coating. That alone is reason enough for me to use it, cleaning bottles being a necessary evil I avoid whenever possible. 90% of the breakeages & boo-boos I have committed have occured while washing & cleaning.


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## Dirranbandi (Aug 11, 2004)

G'day Laidbackjack

 Goanna Oil is an Australian product, originally based on oil derived from Goannas (Lizards) and used as a liniment for sore muscles. 
 The following is a snippet from a local Brisbane website:
 "Joe Marconi was a showman who started a Goanna Oil business in Bulimba in 1910. He became a member of the Balmoral Shire Council in 1921 but was killed in a street brawl in Queen Street the following year. His family continued producing Goanna Oil products until the company was sold to Evan Murdoch in 1982. Production continues in Tennyson, although goannas are no longer used in the process."

 Goanna Oil Liniment can still be purchased today - on-line pharmacies based in Australia are suppliers e.g. www.e-pharmacy.com.au 

 Cheers,

 Dirranbandi


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## LaidBackJack (Aug 12, 2004)

*Lizard Oil!*

G'day Dirranbandi,

        Making lizard oil must have been a nasty job, I wonder if Australian lizard oil would be anything like American "Snake Oil" ?? My girlfriend lived on a sheep ranch somewhere near Sydney for a time back in the 70's,  she says she remembers seeing big lizards but doesn't know if they were Goannas. The biggest lizards here in N.Calif. are midgets compared to your selection in Oz. Good thing, because whenever I dig in a dump around here I encounter lots of lizards, snakes, scorpions, millipedes, and other varmints, which if they were Ozzie versions would probably put me in the hospital....or worse.  At least the rattlesnakes here usually give a warning, the rest are capable of zapping you but no worse than a bee-sting unless you're allergic to it.  I will sometimes catch the snakes, if they are the right kind, and sell them to a guy I know who is a herpetologist.  One time I found a two-headed garter snake! but it was recently dead. I still got $25 for it, & now it sits in a big mason jar full of formalin in my friend's living room. I know guys who go out in our "bush" and collect rattlers, milk them for their venom, and sell it for good money for making anti-venom. No thanks! I'll stick to treasure-hunting.   Cheers, Frank


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