# Temperance Beer



## tolmanbridge (May 5, 2021)

I purchased this beer with a number of other bottles years ago.  Can't find any information on it.  Can anyone here help out?  Would also like some idea of scarcity of this beer.  Has great bubbles in the glass but they don't show up.
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## CanadianBottles (May 5, 2021)

Welcome to the forum!  At first I thought this was going to be a very rare beer to find in such perfect condition, but I did a Google search which raised some suspicions that the label may not be original to the bottle.  Someone is selling another Golden West bottle on Ebay right now, also with a perfect label: https://www.ebay.ca/itm/362715286804?hash=item5473840d14:g:CcMAAOSwXYtY3pWf  The thing is that the one on Ebay is the same label on what appears to be a bottle which is several decades newer than yours.  When you see that sort of thing it typically indicates that a bunch of new-old-stock labels went onto the market at some point and unscrupulous sellers started sticking them onto whatever bottles they could get their hands on.  
It's definitely possible that yours is the real deal, since your bottle looks to be period correct for when the brewery was in operation, but those crisp labels are often not a great sign when it comes to an authentic bottle-label pairing.


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## tolmanbridge (May 6, 2021)

Thanks for your assistance.  I noticed the ebay bottle as well.  The seller does mention it was an "new" old label put on a bottle.  I purchased this bottle with a collection of odds and ends probably fifteen years ago.  My label does have some damage to the corners and left side but that could easily have been done by someone trying to make it look older.  The bottom of the bottle has what appears to be a stylized H.  It sure would be nice to find out if this is the original thing or not.  I included a couple more photos that might help but it still will probably be a mystery.


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## tolmanbridge (May 6, 2021)

CanadianBottles said:


> Welcome to the forum!  At first I thought this was going to be a very rare beer to find in such perfect condition, but I did a Google search which raised some suspicions that the label may not be original to the bottle.  Someone is selling another Golden West bottle on Ebay right now, also with a perfect label: https://www.ebay.ca/itm/362715286804?hash=item5473840d14:g:CcMAAOSwXYtY3pWf  The thing is that the one on Ebay is the same label on what appears to be a bottle which is several decades newer than yours.  When you see that sort of thing it typically indicates that a bunch of new-old-stock labels went onto the market at some point and unscrupulous sellers started sticking them onto whatever bottles they could get their hands on.
> It's definitely possible that yours is the real deal, since your bottle looks to be period correct for when the brewery was in operation, but those crisp labels are often not a great sign when it comes to an authentic bottle-label pairing.


Don't know if I replied correctly with the first message so thought I would include a second to mention I did include some more photos.


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## CanadianBottles (May 6, 2021)

tolmanbridge said:


> Thanks for your assistance.  I noticed the ebay bottle as well.  The seller does mention it was an "new" old label put on a bottle.  I purchased this bottle with a collection of odds and ends probably fifteen years ago.  My label does have some damage to the corners and left side but that could easily have been done by someone trying to make it look older.  The bottom of the bottle has what appears to be a stylized H.  It sure would be nice to find out if this is the original thing or not.  I included a couple more photos that might help but it still will probably be a mystery.


Yeah the damage there likely wasn't put on to make it look older but it could have just happened over the course of its life.  Most correct labels I see from that era are a bit more brittle and flakey, although that isn't the case all of the time.  I'm not really sure what to make of the bottle or what that symbol on the base is.  It gives me a bit of an Asian feeling but I'm not certain about that.  If it is Asian that means it's a lot less likely to be original to the label but that's not 100% certain because some companies would re-use whatever bottles they could get their hands on.


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## tolmanbridge (May 6, 2021)

CanadianBottles said:


> Yeah the damage there likely wasn't put on to make it look older but it could have just happened over the course of its life.  Most correct labels I see from that era are a bit more brittle and flakey, although that isn't the case all of the time.  I'm not really sure what to make of the bottle or what that symbol on the base is.  It gives me a bit of an Asian feeling but I'm not certain about that.  If it is Asian that means it's a lot less likely to be original to the label but that's not 100% certain because some companies would re-use whatever bottles they could get their hands on.


It does kind of remind me of some of the Asian bottles I got from Victoria, B.C.  There are two things that throw me a bit though.  One is I can find a lot of reproduction labels on the internet for Golden West but they are all a different color and slightly different design.   I guess it could just be a vintage label put on an old bottle like the one on eBay but the fact that it also has the small crescent label on top means that they would have had to have access to both types of labels.  That is quite possible but would have been a little harder to get.  And the fact that I have had this bottle for a number of years means it would have had to be done at least fifteen years ago.  Is there anyway to tell the age by the method of applying the label (glue?) or would they have used the same process today as they did 100 years ago?  Otherwise, I am left with what might quite possibly be a vintage label on an old bottle or the real thing and I don't know how to tell the difference.  If only someone else had a bottle from this brewing company so we could compare.


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## tolmanbridge (May 6, 2021)

Was wondering if the color of the bottle might be more consistent with it not being a Canadian beer bottle?  Just read an article that kind of said clear bottles went to brown to keep the beer from going skunky.  Then they went to green around the time of WWII so this bottle, while being the right age, is the wrong color.  Sure wish I could remember exactly where I got it from.  Other than one collection I purchased two years ago and a great Nelson, B.C. pop bottle I found at a garage sale, I haven't purchased bottles for at least ten to fifteen years.  I know it wasn't in the collection I purchased recently.


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## CanadianBottles (May 6, 2021)

tolmanbridge said:


> It does kind of remind me of some of the Asian bottles I got from Victoria, B.C.  There are two things that throw me a bit though.  One is I can find a lot of reproduction labels on the internet for Golden West but they are all a different color and slightly different design.   I guess it could just be a vintage label put on an old bottle like the one on eBay but the fact that it also has the small crescent label on top means that they would have had to have access to both types of labels.  That is quite possible but would have been a little harder to get.  And the fact that I have had this bottle for a number of years means it would have had to be done at least fifteen years ago.  Is there anyway to tell the age by the method of applying the label (glue?) or would they have used the same process today as they did 100 years ago?  Otherwise, I am left with what might quite possibly be a vintage label on an old bottle or the real thing and I don't know how to tell the difference.  If only someone else had a bottle from this brewing company so we could compare.


Usually the genuine labels that are stuck onto old bottles are stuck using the original glue that was already on the back of the label as far as I've been able to tell.  I've never seen anything about them that makes the glue look wrong.  It's also quite common for the neck labels to be included because they would usually have been stored together so if a bunch of main labels were discovered as new old stock, both labels would likely be found.  I definitely don't think it's a reproduction label, if it was I think it would be obvious based on the type of printing.  As for the colour I don't think that tells us much, there were definitely green beer bottles back in the early 20th century as well.  It wasn't really a situation where clear switched to brown then green, it was more a situation where clear bottles fell out of favour and then some brewers switched to green around the time of the war, but brown bottles have always been in use and green wasn't exclusively a wartime thing.  Beer bottles only started becoming fairly standardized in the 30s, before that they'd use all sorts of bottles.  Unfortunately I don't think you'll ever be able to know for sure whether the label is original to the bottle.  Regardless, since you've already got it, might as well keep it in your collection since at least it's a nice label.  I'd keep it if I had it, but I probably wouldn't buy it because I'm too suspicious of the label.


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## Crushy (May 7, 2021)

Don't know if it's helpful but I used to collect a bit of beer stuff from Calgary back in the 80s.   Recall that there seemed to be a fair supply of new old stock labels for Golden West around back then.   Faking labels back then was a lot harder as not every joe with a camera and a printer could do it.  

I also note that in George Choppings's "Bottles of the Canadian Prairies" (1978), he pictures that label on a very similar bottle. Maybe indicative of what they used for that beer, or the book served as inspiration for the individual who stuck the label on. I've included a photo of the bottle for reference. 

Golden West had some beautiful labels. The brewery was bought by Calgary Brewing and Malting Company about 1910 and ran for a number of years. They made beautiful labels. Took a look around and I actually still have one from back then.   Through a pic in of it for reference.


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## mctaggart67 (May 8, 2021)

Somebody here in Calgary has found a stash of these Golden West Brewing labels and they are bleeding them out slowly. They show up at shows, malls, etc. as stand alones and pasted onto bottles onto which the label don't belong. However, yours maybe legit, as it wasn't uncommon for breweries to use any and all types of beer bottles they could get ahold of during times of peak sales (summer, season holiday times, etc.), regardless of whether or not they had their own embossed bottles. After the big flood of 2013, I checked out the Bow River banks south of the old part of the city. Clearly the flooded river had gouged out the bottle dump of the Calgary Brewing and Malting Co., further upstream. I must have found several hundred broken Calgary B & M bottle bottoms (nothing survived the thrashing of the flood waters). Among all these shards were hundreds of bottoms to other brewery bottles from other parts of Canada, the Northern States, Ireland and Great Britain. My best guess is that your bottle fits this use pattern. Then again . . .


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## GRACE ABOUND (May 8, 2021)

mctaggart67 said:


> Somebody here in Calgary has found a stash of these Golden West Brewing labels and they are bleeding them out slowly. They show up at shows, malls, etc. as stand alones and pasted onto bottles onto which the label don't belong. However, yours maybe legit, as it wasn't uncommon for breweries to use any and all types of beer bottles they could get ahold of during times of peak sales (summer, season holiday times, etc.), regardless of whether or not they had their own embossed bottles. After the big flood of 2013, I checked out the Bow River banks south of the old part of the city. Clearly the flooded river had gouged out the bottle dump of the Calgary Brewing and Malting Co., further upstream. I must have found several hundred broken Calgary B & M bottle bottoms (nothing survived the thrashing of the flood waters). Among all these shards were hundreds of bottoms to other brewery bottles from other parts of Canada, the Northern States, Ireland and Great Britain. My best guess is that your bottle fits this use pattern. Then again . . .
> [/QUOTE  ]Golden West  Brewing Co Operates Out Of West Coast Of Austrail;ia. The Old Co. WAS An Old Co. Said to be 150 years  Coke Bought them Out And Closed Down IN The 1970's It Is Now Opened Up With A Group Of Young Men .You Can Read All About it On Google .For All Information And You Can Also Order  6/622 Newcastle St. Leederville 6007 AUSTRAILIA. check address with the one on google .


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## tolmanbridge (May 12, 2021)

Crushy said:


> Don't know if it's helpful but I used to collect a bit of beer stuff from Calgary back in the 80s.   Recall that there seemed to be a fair supply of new old stock labels for Golden West around back then.   Faking labels back then was a lot harder as not every joe with a camera and a printer could do it.
> 
> I also note that in George Choppings's "Bottles of the Canadian Prairies" (1978), he pictures that label on a very similar bottle. Maybe indicative of what they used for that beer, or the book served as inspiration for the individual who stuck the label on. I've included a photo of the bottle for reference.
> 
> Golden West had some beautiful labels. The brewery was bought by Calgary Brewing and Malting Company about 1910 and ran for a number of years. They made beautiful labels. Took a look around and I actually still have one from back then.   Through a pic in of it for reference.


My bottle does seem to resemble the one in the photo.  Did the book give you any information on that particular bottle?


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## tolmanbridge (May 12, 2021)

mctaggart67 said:


> Somebody here in Calgary has found a stash of these Golden West Brewing labels and they are bleeding them out slowly. They show up at shows, malls, etc. as stand alones and pasted onto bottles onto which the label don't belong. However, yours maybe legit, as it wasn't uncommon for breweries to use any and all types of beer bottles they could get ahold of during times of peak sales (summer, season holiday times, etc.), regardless of whether or not they had their own embossed bottles. After the big flood of 2013, I checked out the Bow River banks south of the old part of the city. Clearly the flooded river had gouged out the bottle dump of the Calgary Brewing and Malting Co., further upstream. I must have found several hundred broken Calgary B & M bottle bottoms (nothing survived the thrashing of the flood waters). Among all these shards were hundreds of bottoms to other brewery bottles from other parts of Canada, the Northern States, Ireland and Great Britain. My best guess is that your bottle fits this use pattern. Then again . . .


Thank you for the information.  It seems I just won't know if the piece is original or not.


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## Crushy (May 12, 2021)

tolmanbridge said:


> My bottle does seem to resemble the one in the photo.  Did the book give you any information on that particular bottle?


Very little.  Just the reference # that he created,  and that the bottle was 23.5 cm x 6.7 cm, greem  341 ml and has a "2" on the base.    In price guide supplement, he assigned a value of $5 to the bottle - which, by comparison to others in the guide, would suggest it was pretty common or undesirable at that time.


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## Crushy (May 12, 2021)

Crushy said:


> Very little.  Just the reference # that he created,  and that the bottle was 23.5 cm x 6.7 cm, greem  341 ml and has a "2" on the base.    In price guide supplement, he assigned a value of $5 to the bottle - which, by comparison to others in the guide, would suggest it was pretty common or undesirable at that time.


that should be "green"


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