# 1939 PAPER LABEL BROWN 7 UP BOTTLE



## bamascavenger (Oct 25, 2008)

PAPER SAYS 1939 but the bottom numbers kind of point to it being a 1945? It is on Ebay now, Here is the link what do you think?
http://cgi.ebay.com/Vintage-Antique-Brown-Glass-7UP-Soda-Pop-Bottle_W0QQitemZ170273886447QQcmdZViewItem?hash=item170273886447&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14&_trkparms=72%3A1205%7C66%3A2%7C65%3A12%7C39%3A1%7C240%3A1318


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## digger mcdirt (Oct 25, 2008)

Looks like a repo label has been glued on a beer bottle to me. Repo lables are all over e fee for 7 ups. BOB


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## kbobam (Oct 25, 2008)

I'm not disagreeing at all, and am very suspicious of paper label bottles on the bay.  Some people seem to be very creative when it comes to "aging" them.  On the other hand, the use of beer bottles during the Depression years, which overlapped Prohibition for several years, was not unheard of.  And dating bottles by code seems to be a pretty inexact science.  Another Bob


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## thesodafizz (Oct 25, 2008)

My two cents...(and probably more than you wanted to know anyway) : 

 The label states 1939....and claims :Nagel Bev. Co. in Boise, Idaho......   I don't have info on what years Nagel bottled 7Up (perhaps Dennis Fewliess does - or someone could call and ask - they are still in business, "Since 1895 - for the purpose for bottling soda water to be sold to area saloons - Ph: (208) 475-1250,  NagelBev.com)) and what the bottle looked like they used this label for in 1945.

 I agree with the previous post tho - these labels are easy to get on eBay.  I have gotten a couple of them for real 7Up (embossed on the bottom) bottles that I wanted to label for my own collection, display purposes only (which I haven't done yet, matter of fact, I don't even know where I've put the labels).  This label looks "old," but some dirt (or tea) and a little scuffing on the label can give it that look.  But also, the label fits the size of the bottle well......and altho I have seen the larger bottles, I have never paid any attention to the mold marks on the bottom.  Perhaps I should have.

 A collector (and employee) of Pepsi-Cola has a similar bottle in his collection (pictured, but not for sale), but his is from New Mexico.  His description of it does not give the date, but it states, according to the label, it is from the Howdy Co., 1935, but the bottle most likely is dated later, because he gives base markings as Owens-Illinois with a range of 1929-1954.  (All of Toulouse's dates for Owens-Illinois begin with 1930...?)  The reason I say this is it probably threw him off for the label to say 1939 and the bottle mark perhaps have a later date.....

 According to the bottle marks on the eBay bottle, it's Plant 20 for O-I.  Toulouse's _Bottle Marks_ book gives the info that O-I started putting Duraglas on the bottles in 1940 (or so).  For a period of time, both the I-O mark and Duraglas was there, such as with this bottle with its "45".   

 Plant 20 (also according to Toulouse) was in Backinridge, Pa. from 1932-1940 and then the number was reassigned to the plant in Oakland, Calif. in 1946 and was in use in Oakland when he wrote the book in 1971 (and for who knows how long after).  Now, that causes a problem with timing - as the bottle is "dated" 1945.  So, unless Oakland was in use a year before before Toulouse documented these dates or Backinridge was still producing bottles long after he listed them to be.   I would speculate that it's more possible for Oakland to produce a bottle a year before (and Toulouse missed it?) than Backinridge producing 5 years after an end date listing.  And if the bottle is authentic, is Boise within a reasonable distance to order bottles from Oakland?  

 Also, what little bit of quick research I managed to do while writing this turned up that there's many of these same kinds of bottles with these labels on them from all over the place.  

 Now, if we just knew what mold 4365-G was used for: beer or soda - or both - it may help to validate at least this particular one.   Perhaps if someone has that mold mark on a bottle definitely known to be a beer (or soda) bottle.....?  We could add that tidbit of info to our thread.

 Toulouse adds that when Duraglas was used (after 1940) on beer bottles, it was along with stippling.  Is this bottle stippled?

 So, what does all this mean?   I am not sure, but it is all I could come up with.  

 And, after all, if this is a case of re-using beer bottles during those lean years makes all this info moot anyway.......

 Is this 7Up bottle authentic?  I have no idea.  There's always that chance....  The opening bid is $9.99 and someone has bid it.   The seller has 100% positive feedback, so....perhaps he isn't looking to rip someone off.   Would I bid on it - maybe.   Would I buy it if I came across it for $10 (give or take) in a booth where I could see it in person, most probably.  Why?  Because of the size - the size of the bottle matches (the best I can tell) the size on the label, and that size, with a paper label, isn't something you run across every day.  I'd take the chance on it being non-authentic over missing out on it if it weren't.  

 Note:  When I first started collecting, I bought a paper-labeled amber Seven-Up bottle that I was thrilled to have.  Later, I found out it was a label on a beer bottle (before I knew that kind of thing happened).   Do I still have that bottle? Yes, I do.  Is it still on my shelf? Yes, it is.   Why?  So, I can show others why it's not a Seven-Up bottle.....


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## bamascavenger (Oct 26, 2008)

Great thread. I know if i remember correctly there is a person on here that knows what the 4245 g numbers mean? Kathy, Did you take a deep breath before typing all that? HaHa. And are we feeling much better now? Great to see you back on.
 T.


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## thesodafizz (Oct 28, 2008)

Yeah, feeling a bit better.  Sometimes I don't know where I get all that long windedness (or long fingersness) from, but it happens from time to time. 

 I was working on the Soda Fizz the other night when I saw the post about the bottle and decided it was a welcome break to stop and have some fun doing something else for a few minutes.  Keeps me busy,  but I love it.

 Hopefully the one who knows what those numbers mean will drop by and leave us a post about it here too.   I know there's one glass maker that used letters with the mold #s to identify the bottle's purpose, like B for beer, S for soda, etc., but I don't think it was O-I.   I need to brush up on my info - sometimes it's hard to remember everything.    It's a mold mark and I've seen pages (to illustrate articles) from the glass maker's cataloges, but for what - I dunno.

 K


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