# Civil War Bullets Found- News Story



## RedGinger (Aug 10, 2011)

http://www.examiner.com/civil-war-heritage-in-washington-dc/a-surprising-find-at-gettysburg


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## surfaceone (Aug 10, 2011)

Thanks for that story, Lauren.


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## Rockhounder55 (Aug 10, 2011)

Great story Laur. I've been to Gettysburg twice. In 1968, when I was a mere lad, and again in 1992. Oddly enough, when I was there in 1968, we went to Culp's Hill. I brought home a rock from there, and I still have it to this day. []  ~Mike


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## coreya (Aug 11, 2011)

shouldn't the bullet have been deeper in the tree since the war was 150 + years ago when the bullet was fired that hit that tree, and the tree grows from the outside 1 inch or so which makes the rings ever expanding? I've cut down my fair share of old oaks and one 150 + years old would be a bit larger around than that one. Just an observation!


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## surfaceone (Aug 11, 2011)

Hey Corey,

 It's a Sycamore. They're pretty slow growing. Not quite as hard as an oak. A possible trajectory of that ball could'a had it a hand an a half deep. 

 Here's some WWII shrapnel in a relatively immature pine.




From.


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## GuntherHess (Aug 11, 2011)

> shouldn't the bullet have been deeper in the tree since the war was 150 + years ago when the bullet was fired that hit that tree, and the tree grows from the outside 1 inch or so which makes the rings ever expanding? I've cut down my fair share of old oaks and one 150 + years old would be a bit larger around than that one. Just an observation!


 
 ya there a few things wrong with that picture.  As you mention the bullet is in the outside of the tree. The tree would have had to have died not too long after the bullet hit and would have rotted in all that time. The bullet has a white oxidized lead patina. Bullets get this from being in the ground for 100 years. One in wood isnt likely to have this. If they cut that with a chain saw and exposed that much of the bullet its likely they would have scraped the patina off it on the cut side. You should be seeing bare lead. Finallly, unjacketted lead civil war bullets deform a lot when they hit something hard like an oak tree. That bullet looks pretty much intact like a dropped round.

 cool story, maybe  its true 

 It is possible to find civil war bullets in old wood. I have found a couple and there are many well know examples.


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## bostaurus (Aug 11, 2011)

From the way the rotting is on the outside of the tree it looks as if the tree was doing poorly for awhile before it fell or was cut.  There seems to be a few inches  of the tree missing from the rot.  That would place the bullet deeper than it seems.  Still not as deep as you would expect though.  I wonder if the tree has been down for a long time and they are just getting around the removing it?
 It does seem odd that cutting the tree did not leave bare lead showing..  Did they have bullets made of some sort of ceramic or stone like material?


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## RedGinger (Aug 11, 2011)

Interesting questions, guys.  I don't know enough about this type of thing to chime in, but I didn't think they would just make up a story.  I wish they would have shown more close-ups, as Surface was able to do.  I couldn't find a link with a good picture.

 I was just thinking about what Gunth said, and I know the type of bullet they made then, pretty much exploded when it went inside the body, destroying a lot (can't think of the name of that effect besides the term mushrooming).  When it hit something hard, compared to the soft human body, I guess the result would be different.  Then you have to think about how old the tree was back then.  Why don't they just count the rings and see?


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## cc6pack (Aug 11, 2011)

I agree with Matt, if the log had been cut as said the bullet would show signs of the cut. If the bullet was fired into a living tree the tree would have sealed the wound and the bullet would not have been exposed to the air and oxidized. It takes about 60 years for lead to oxidize to the point pictured. 

 Surface

 Not trying to start anything but technically you have shell fragments from WWII. Although the term shrapnel is used interchangeably with shell fragment it is not correct. The link below will exlpain it in more detail.

 http://www.history.army.mil/faq/shrapnel.htm


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## GuntherHess (Aug 11, 2011)

> Did they have bullets made of some sort of ceramic or stone like material?


 
 just lead for small arms.  No doubt a few CSA solders tried rocks or marbles but they dont make good projectiles.


 I'd like to see a close up too.

 Here is a Williams cleaner bullet in a peice of wood. You can see its smashed pretty well.


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## coreya (Aug 11, 2011)

Just a little more thought on the subject, 1st, The person reporting this is a federal employee and we all know the federal govt doesn"t LIE, 2nd, lets say the tree was there in 1863 and took a bullet, the tree would have to have been large enough to take the hit and survive, say 12" around which would allow a 6" penetration (and would be aprox 6 years old). Now a live oak grows an average of 1/2 " around per year (see link ref live oak Taxonomy, http://www.sms.si.edu/irlspec/quercu_virginic.htm  ) ( I use Live Oak because almost all other types of oaks do not live that long) after 150 years the tree would have a circumfrence of 75" or 6.25 feet and the bullet would be near the center of the tree 3 feet from the outside because the tree grows along the outside 1" or so under the bark. 
 This is just my personal observation and opinion and since we all know that you can believe everything you read in a paper, I must be mistaken!!


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## surfaceone (Aug 12, 2011)

Hey Corey,

 I just reread the article . It sez, "on a routine clearing of a fallen oak tree on Culpâ€™s Hill, chain-sawed into minie balls imbedded in the trunk." 

 So, it's not a Syacamore but, also not a Live Oak, _Quercus virginiana_. They grow from Virginia, south to Florida. If it's really an Oak, it would be Northern Red Oak, _Quercus rubra_,

 "In forests, the northern red oak grows straight and tall, to 28 m (90 ft), exceptionally to 43 m (140 ft) tall, with a trunk of up to 50-100 cm (20-40 in) diameter." From.

 It's trashier sub-specie the Pin Oak, _Quercus palustris_ "is a medium-sized deciduous tree growing to 18-22 m (60-70 ft) tall, with a trunk up to 1 m (3 ft) diameter." From.

 Or a White Oak, _Quercus alba_ "White oaks have been known to live up to six hundred years."

 I can't tell from the picture what exact species. The Minie ball just looks white. So does that goofy lookin Ranger guy. There was very heavy fighting on Culp's Hill.











 "Charge of the 2nd Maryland Infantry, CSA into the "slaughterpen" at Culp's Hill, Battle of Gettysburg, July 3, 1863. So severe were the casualties among the Marylanders that General Steuart is said to have broken down and wept, wringing his hands and crying "my poor boys". From.

 That tree could be riddled with balls.

 I useta work in a sawmill in the west. One area of timber that was cut had been the site of strafing practice by various 2nd War aircraft. If the head rig saw hit the steel cored .50 cal rounds it would peel the teeth off and "shoot" them around the mill floor. This would really get one's attention in a hurry.

 Lesser rounds and buried barbed wire, spikes, and all the other tramp metal always had that fresh torn shivered metal look after a close encounter with the various saws. Kept the saw filer busy.

 The growth of the tree around the bullet, or wound can take on a crazy burly kinda grain, as if mimicking shock waves from the injury.


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## Erik T (Aug 13, 2011)

Thats pretty cool! someone had a post too about insulators found embedded in trees.

 On another note i read somewhere that civil war musket/minie balls were found lodged in old alligator snapping turtles down south, therefore allowing scientists to determine the lifespan of the turtles to be somewhere around 150 years.


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## RedGinger (Aug 13, 2011)

> ORIGINAL:  Erik T
> 
> Thats pretty cool! someone had a post too about insulators found embedded in trees.
> 
> On another note i read somewhere that civil war musket/minie balls were found lodged in old alligator snapping turtles down south, therefore allowing scientists to determine the lifespan of the turtles to be somewhere around 150 years.


 
 I feel bad for the turtles, but that is wild.


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## JOETHECROW (Aug 13, 2011)

cool topic...


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