# WOW! The oldest 7up EVER! LOL



## bne74honda (Nov 7, 2010)

Hey All,

 people will try anything on eBay. Check out this 7up bottle that 'Pre Dates "Bubble Girl"'.

 http://cgi.ebay.ca/Antique-7UP-Bottle-Pre-Dates-Bubble-Girl-/260686002750?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item3cb218ba3e#ht_500wt_1156

 Gee whizz Beav....Dad'll love that one!


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## SODAPOPBOB (Nov 7, 2010)

bne74honda ~

 Here is a photo of the 7up bottle in question. The style looks like a deco bottle from the 1920s-30s. But the applied color label (acl) suggest it could not be any earlier than about 1934-35 when the acl process was first introduced. Following this page I will post a "for sure" 1935 bottle that pre-dates the bubble girl.

 SPBOB


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## SODAPOPBOB (Nov 7, 2010)

This 7up bottle belongs to member wonkapete and was posted on another thread. Wonka confirmed the date at 1935. 

 But whether the clear example currently on e-bay was earlier and/or the first is, for me, a subject of debate. Only by doing some indepth research will we likely ever know for sure. But if it is real, and not faked, it surely would be a rare bottle. I admit it looks real. But whether it's worth $1,400.00 is another question.  ???

 SPBOB

 1935 7up acl bottle (pre-bubble girl) ... courtesy wonkapete.


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## cyberdigger (Nov 7, 2010)

Well, let's see.. 7up was first made in 1929, so it isn't older than that. I am wondering if this label is not the actual ACL process, perhaps it was painted on or stenciled? Maybe a transition technique? Just a guess..
 Is it unusual for ACL paint to chip away like this? I would also kinda like to know what the base embossing is?


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## SODAPOPBOB (Nov 7, 2010)

Cyber ~

 Ditto on checking the base embossing. But I have to believe one of the so called experts, or the seller himself, would have done that already. But I guess you never know. I'm shooting the seller an e-mail right now and find out. I will let everyone know what they have to say when I get a reply.

 Who knows, maybe we just found that 1934 acl we have been looking for.  ???  I hope! - I hope! - I hope!  []

 SPBOB

 Plus ... Here's another 1935 bottle (Amber). This is the first bubble-girl that I know of. It's me holding it, and is currently in a museum I know of.


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## morbious_fod (Nov 7, 2010)

> ORIGINAL:  cyberdigger
> 
> Well, let's see.. 7up was first made in 1929, so it isn't older than that. I am wondering if this label is not the actual ACL process, perhaps it was painted on or stenciled? Maybe a transition technique? Just a guess..
> Is it unusual for ACL paint to chip away like this? I would also kinda like to know what the base embossing is?


 
 Note that the acl actually says 7-up Bottling Company York, PA. If this was a dedicated 7-Up bottle then it would have the brand name in an acl by itself. Just as bottles that say Coca-Cola Bottling Company of so and so aren't used to bottle Coca-Cola, which is reserved for the script bottles, this bottle was most likely used to bottle a flavor line of this particular 7-Up Bottling Company. Best proof possible is the fact that it is a clear bottle, who in their right mind, aside from Canada Dry, would bottle a clear liquid in a clear bottle? I also note that the seller has not included the date on the bottle to back up his claim. It is most likely one of the earlier acls as I don't see a nub on this side of the bottle for holding the bottle for the acl application. Could be on the other side.


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## SODAPOPBOB (Nov 7, 2010)

I totally agree with Morb about it being a fruit flavored bottle. Some research on the York, PA bottling company may produce something. But it's the "style" of bottle that confuses me now. How long was this style made? 1920s thru the 19?0s   ???

          I just heard from the e-bay seller and here is the reply copy/pasted in their own words.

                                                                   ~ * ~

 The bottom of the bottle says:

 Cont. 7 Fluid Ozs. 7927-2b54

 If this gives you any info that you could pass on to us I would appreciate it. 

 Thank You!!

                                                                  ~ * ~

 My immediate reaction was to assume the 54 was for 1954. (There's no way the 27 is for 1927).  But since I really don't recognize the code combination, I will refrain from jumping to conclusions with the hope that somebody else can identify it with certainty. I am not sure if there is a maker's mark symbol that accompanied the above. What you see is all I know at present. But I think if there had been a symbol the seller would have mentioned it.

 Please let me know if anybody can make sense of the numbers/letter. I would like to inform the seller of our findings.

 Thanks.

 SPBOB


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## OsiaBoyce (Nov 7, 2010)

"7Up Bottling Co.", that says it all.


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## splante (Nov 7, 2010)

would like to see the bottom of the bottle to see how the 2b 54 is laid out......iam thinking 54 sounds right...but seeng the base may confirm


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## morbious_fod (Nov 7, 2010)

It wouldn't shock me if it was a 54. Companies used deco bottles for several years after acls became the common form.


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## fishnuts (Nov 7, 2010)

My two cents:
 Agree with morb...I don't believe this to be a 7Up bottle and if it was, it would say so.  I believe that it is from the 7Up bottler, as it says exactly so.

 I also think anyone with a decent sized embossed bottle accumulation would be able to find this bottle design on another bottle, or two, from which to make date comparisons.  Not a believer in this being a mid-3o's entry, however, but i am not able to look closely or touch it.  Weight and feel could make a difference.  
 The poor acl could be just that...only a poor roughed up acl and not indicative of dateline.  The white seems unusually so and quite opaque in spite of its condition.  Remember, early white paints ran towards translucent rather than  opaque.


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## SODAPOPBOB (Nov 7, 2010)

Unless the majority of us feel it is too soon to draw a conclusion, I would like to send the e-bay seller the following message. However, I have no intention, and see no need to mention this website or thread. What I had in mind is ...

                                                                   ~ * ~

 It is the opinion of myself and several other soda bottle collectors that your most interesting bottle was produced by a 7up "Bottler" but that it never contained the actual 7up product. Most likely it contained fruit flavors like strawberry - grape - etc. It was a common practice for most of the major brands, including Coca Cola and others, to use a clear glass bottle for these various fruit flavors.

 As for the coded numbers, it is our combined opinon that the bottle was made in 1954. Which isn't neccessarily that old considering the fact that the 7up company was first established in 1929. Their earliest known applied color label (acl) bottle appeared around 1935. 

 As for value ... We seriously doubt it is worth more than ...   ????

                                                                  ~ * ~ 

 I will need some help with the value part, and would appreciate any and all opinions. Remember, the opening bid was $1,499.99 ... which is totally nuts in my humble opinion.

 Also, if you have suggestions on alternative wordings to the above message, please share that too. Remember, my reputation is on the line here.  Lol  []  Yeah, right!

 Thanks,

 SPBOB


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## SODAPOPBOB (Nov 7, 2010)

I am certain that all will find the following message very, very interesting. I just this minute received it from my always helpful buddy, Bill Lockhart. I wrote him earlier today and this is what he had to say ...  Copy/Pasted exactly as sent to me.

Hi Bob,[/align] [/align]That bottle is not even worth $5.  The bottle is a flavor bottle used by the York, PA franchise.  It is not a 7-Up bottle at all.  Many soda bottlers had their own "house brands" of fruit flavors.  Originally, that was the only type of flavors, before franchise flavors (like Howdy Orange, Whistle, Orange Crush, etc.) were ever offered on a national basis.[/align] [/align]The earliest ACL bottles were not even sodas.  I will have to find the ad, but one of the glass houses (I think it was Brockway) offered its version of ACL on drug store bottles in 1933.  The method was available for soda and milk bottles the following year.[/align] [/align]Initially, the process could only be used on the cylindrical part of the bottle.  The slope of the shoulder, where the York bottle has its ACL, was beyond the original ability of the glass houses.  I believe it was 1938 before ACL could be applied to the shoulders.  I'm sure that the shoulder of your 1935 ACL 7-Up bottle has the "7 up" in embossed form.[/align] [/align]Owens-Illinois actually pioneered the process and used it on bottles by at least December 1930, but the firm did not offer ACL bottles for sale until 1934.[/align] [/align]The earliest date code I have seen was also from 1935 and was on a 7-Up bottle.[/align] [/align]Sorry to bring bad news.[/align] [/align]Bill[/align] [/align]


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## SODAPOPBOB (Nov 8, 2010)

bne74honda ~

 I wanted to thank you for opening up this topic, and for allowing me and others the liberty of expounding on it. And to show my appreciation I wanted to share the link below regarding some additional information on the history of the early 7up bottles. The article was written by Bill Lockhart and was published in the 2005 Jan-Feb issue of "The Soda Fizz" magazine. 

 I sent a reply to the e-bay seller with our collective findings, but have not heard back from him. We may have burst his (7up) bubble by informing him that his bottle was not worth the $1,499.99 opening bid price. I don't like to tease people, especially when they think one thing that turns out to be another, but it wouldn't surprise me if he re-list the bottle with a new opening bid of $4.99. But based on what I know about it now, I personally wouldn't even pay that much. It's in pretty rough shape. If I saw it in an antique shop I "might" pay $2.00, but that's about it.

 Anyway, here's the link. I hope you and others enjoy it. And thanks again for sharing a most interesting subject.

 SPBOB

 Bill Lockhart 7up Article Link :  http://www.sha.org/bottle/pdffiles/BLockhart_7UpBottlers.pdf


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## blobbottlebob (Nov 8, 2010)

Nice work SPB,
 I think some people believe they won the lottery when they find an old bottle, get just enough information that it is old - collectible - but not the usual thing - and think HEY, I can cash this in for $1,500. If the seller was a more serious bottle type, he would have learned more, and found out that really rare bottles are; well, really rare.

 That bottle has all of the earmarkings of a two dollar bottle. But what the heck. If someone buys it, he's rich!


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## celerycola (Nov 8, 2010)

> ORIGINAL:  bne74honda
> 
> Hey All,
> 
> ...





> http://cgi.ebay.ca/Antique-7UP-Bottle-Pre-Dates-Bubble-Girl-/260686002750?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item3cb218ba3e#ht_500wt_1156


 
 This is a common bottle I see often on my monthly trips through PA. I don't recall the date codes on these.


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## cobaltbot (Nov 8, 2010)

WOW!  I think I have one of those extremely valuable bottles in my collection[][][]!   According to the York bottle book:

 "Coke competitor, Seven-Up, began life in York as Yorkdale Beverage at 254 West Princess Street in 1942. By the late 40's the name had been changed to Seven-Up Bottling Co.  Soda bottles with a paneled design embossed YORKDALE BEVERAGE CO. can be found.  The early small green silk-screened Seven-Up bottles with the "girl with the beachball" can be found from Yorkdale Beverage Co. or from Seven-Up Bottling Co.  The Seven-Up Bottling Co. also bottled a product called GOODY as well as Frostie Root Beer silk-screened bottles from both can be found.  They closed in the 1960's."

 1954 sounds dead on.


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## SODAPOPBOB (Nov 8, 2010)

Since we have already seen a couple of the other early 7up bpttles, I figured I'd throw this one into the mix just for the heck of it. It is a squat-amber that belongs to member Dragon0421 and is dated 1936. According to the list I have there were only four states (but various cities from those states) that produced this "stubby" bottle. The states were ...

                                                 S.C. - Texas - Tenn. - Louisiana

                                      Dragon0421's 1936 amber-squat-stubby 7up bottle.


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## SODAPOPBOB (Nov 8, 2010)

Footnote ...  (Correction)

 Not all of the stubby's were acls. Some had paper labels. Note on the list below that San Diego, California was the only city to produced the "standard/slender" variation of these amber bottles. Which is special to me because I live in the San Diego area. (And no ... I don't have one yet, but I'm working on it).

                                                            Hey Morb ~

                        Do you have the Johnson City bottle? I bet (and hope) you do.  []


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## waskey (Nov 8, 2010)

I might be able to help some. The B on the bottom most likely is the Buck Glass Co. of Baltimore, Maryland. They made many soda bottles from all over. Their date code had the date to the right of the B always. Therefore if this is a Buck Bottle its a 1954 bottle but im not 100% sure its a Buck Bottle. I would need to see it.


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## SODAPOPBOB (Nov 8, 2010)

waskey ~

 Here's something I found on the Buck Glass Company ...

 B (without serifs) ... in some cases, perhaps Buck Glass Company, Baltimore, MD (c.1909-1961). Buck Glass was sold to Knox Glass, Inc. in 1961.

 The term "serif" refers to the two little end points where the top and bottom of the B stick out on the left. On a letter like M there are four of the little overhanging serifs (two on top and two on the bottom). Plus, the reference above says "in some cases" ... "perhaps" ...  But the e-bay seller indicated it as a small b ... So I'm not sure what to think. The dates certainly work, though.

 SPBOB


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## splante (Nov 9, 2010)

a little history 7 Up was created by Charles Leiper Grigg, who launched his St. Louis-based company The Howdy Corporation in 1920.[1] Grigg came up with the formula for a lemon-lime soft drink in 1929. The product, originally named "Bib-Label Lithiated Lemon-Lime Soda", was launched two weeks before the Wall Street Crash of 1929.[2] It contained lithium citrate, a mood-stabilizing drug. It was one of a number of patent medicine products popular in the late-19th and early-20th centuries. Specifically it was marketed as a hangover cure.

 Philip Morris bought 7 Up in 1978, and sold it in 1986, to a group led by the investment firm Hicks & Haas. 7 Up merged with Dr Pepper in 1988; Cadbury Schweppes bought the combined company in 1995. The Dr Pepper Snapple Group was spun off from Cadbury Schweppes in 2008.


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## athometoo (Nov 9, 2010)

found this and had to chime in . 

 [*]1929 The Howdy Company debuted its new drink "Bib-Label Lithiated Lemon-Lime Sodas" later called "7 Up". Invented by Charles Leiper Grigg.
 [*]1934 Applied color labels first used on soft drink bottles, the coloring was baked on the face of the bottle.


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## SODAPOPBOB (Nov 10, 2010)

I must be on a 7up kick these days. I keep finding myself searching the internet for various 7up related items. Which is where I found the following. It was on Digger O'Dell's website and goes all the way back to 2002. The bummer of it is there was the following question, but no reply from Digger. This one involves a Canadian 7up bottle. It seems like the 7up company was as disorganized as the rest of the brands back in the day. The info below is copy/pasted exactly from Digger's site, but I can't quite figure out the date of the bottle in question. There is mention of an '8' which could be for 1938 (Surely not 1928). Anyway, I thought it was just interesting enough to post here.

                                                                   ~ * ~


 From: Liz lburk
 Subject: Unusual Seven-Up bottle
 Date: 09-03-2002

 Hi Digger, Great, informative site you have. We dug up on our property this 7up bottle. I have included a couple of scans ( hope you can see them). 1. The bottle is clear. (not green like all other 7up bottles I have seen) 2. It is embossed. Embossing on front reads: Property of SEVEN-UP KELOWNA LTD. Kelowna, B. C. On rear of bottle :CONTENTS 6 1/2 FL. OZS On bottom of bottle : 2 C (diamond with dot in the middle and below) then 8 also with an "orange peel" finish 3. ABM - with lines all the way to the top 4. Crown Top 5. 7 5/8" tall 6. Some outside wear scratching, no cracks or chips. If you could tell me anything about this bottle, history, origins, rarity, value WHY it would be appreciated. Thankyou, Liz Burkinshaw Kelowna, B. C. Canada Attachments:

                                                                 ~ * ~

                       The bottle is another one of them 'weird' deco styles ... but I like it!  []

                                                               SPBOB[/align]


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