# older metal tool ? found off a dock



## RCO

found this off a dock using a metal magnet , the dock has been there since 1870's . its been a busy location for some time so I had a hard time determining what this item was or when its from .

it appeared to have been down there for a long time , as its very dirty and dark black coloured . size is around 4 or 5 " wide and 7 or 8 " long

not exactly sure what it is ? appears to have had a handle or attached to something . not much of a tool person so not able to id it any further .


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## Csa

My first thought was a whaling implement. You ever heard of a flensing knife. Most are much diff shaped and sharp, but I’ve seen this shape too. Any evidence of a sharp edge on it?  That’s my only hunch. Could be any kind of boating/fishing tool from bygone era. Where is this dock located?


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## CanadianBottles

Csa said:


> My first thought was a whaling implement. You ever heard of a flensing knife. Most are much diff shaped and sharp, but I’ve seen this shape too. Any evidence of a sharp edge on it?  That’s my only hunch. Could be any kind of boating/fishing tool from bygone era. Where is this dock located?


RCO is in the Muskoka region of Ontario, so I'm pretty confident it doesn't have anything to do with whaling.  That's a few hundred kilometres too far inland to find any whales.  I'm at a loss as to what it is though, doesn't look like any tool I've ever seen before, apart from an ice chopper.  Which I guess it could be, since it was found in Ontario.  Never seen one that was rounded though, and I have no idea what purpose those holes would have.


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## RCO

Csa said:


> My first thought was a whaling implement. You ever heard of a flensing knife. Most are much diff shaped and sharp, but I’ve seen this shape too. Any evidence of a sharp edge on it?  That’s my only hunch. Could be any kind of boating/fishing tool from bygone era. Where is this dock located?



found off a dock in a fresh water lake in Ontario Canada , not near an ocean . never been a commercial fishery there either

is a lot of boats there , seen pictures from the past and that area was filled with wooden boats , canoes etc

was a lot of logging here , during the winter was people who removed bricks of ice from the lakes to ship to other places


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## RCO

CanadianBottles said:


> RCO is in the Muskoka region of Ontario, so I'm pretty confident it doesn't have anything to do with whaling.  That's a few hundred kilometres too far inland to find any whales.  I'm at a loss as to what it is though, doesn't look like any tool I've ever seen before, apart from an ice chopper.  Which I guess it could be, since it was found in Ontario.  Never seen one that was rounded though, and I have no idea what purpose those holes would have.




I'm pretty sure its not missing any parts either ( other than a wooden handle ) 

so left totally confused as to what it might of been for , but as it appeared to have been down there for a long time , thinking its at least older than the 1940's


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## willong

RCO said:


> found this off a dock using a metal magnet , the dock has been there since 1870's . its been a busy location for some time so I had a hard time determining what this item was or when its from .
> 
> it appeared to have been down there for a long time , as its very dirty and dark black coloured . size is around 4 or 5 " wide and 7 or 8 " long
> 
> not exactly sure what it is ? appears to have had a handle or attached to something . not much of a tool person so not able to id it any further .
> 
> View attachment 225439View attachment 225440


I generally get a kick out of these "what is it" teasers. This is one where I sincerely hope someone comes up with a definitive answer as I am just going with my best two, minimally-educated guesses. If the "blade" or "spoon" portion of the implement is significantly cupped (it's hard to tell in the plan view), then I think that CanadianBottles is on the right track--it is likely the bit of an ice auger. If instead, that blade portion is relatively flat, then I think it might be a bark spud (tool for peeling logs). The through-slots are a bit baffling in either case. The handle ferrule on a bark spud is often kicked up from the plane of the blade, like most shovels, on the order of 15-degrees; but that is not always the case.


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## Csa

Agreed. So whaling tool is out. Perhaps logging implement. Best of luck in finding out.


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## yacorie

So I love these mysteries also and spent some time digging through old pictures and drawings of both logging and ice harvest tools.  I was not able to come up with a match.  The ice harvest tools that are anywhere near similar were ice breakers but they were all metal and having one that wasn’t forged as one piece would make no sense.

when I first saw it - my thought was some type of mixing paddle - something that moved easier through liquid with those slats but who knows.

the problem with port areas, whether they were freshwater or not is that it really could be anything.  The good thing here is it seems like the type of thing that someone will recognize immediately if they know what it is.

have you tried posting it on any metal detecting or antique ID pages?


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## RCO

yacorie said:


> So I love these mysteries also and spent some time digging through old pictures and drawings of both logging and ice harvest tools.  I was not able to come up with a match.  The ice harvest tools that are anywhere near similar were ice breakers but they were all metal and having one that wasn’t forged as one piece would make no sense.
> 
> when I first saw it - my thought was some type of mixing paddle - something that moved easier through liquid with those slats but who knows.
> 
> the problem with port areas, whether they were freshwater or not is that it really could be anything.  The good thing here is it seems like the type of thing that someone will recognize immediately if they know what it is.
> 
> have you tried posting it on any metal detecting or antique ID pages?



no I haven't asked anyone else what it was , just found it yesterday . don't really know anyone here into old tools or metal objects 

i agree that since it was found in a port/ dock area is a lot of possible options as to where it came from 

there was a number of small boat buildings , canoes in that area , also a small marina , long since disappeared hotel 

lake I found it on is fairly large but never had a fishery , been some logging over the years , mostly high end cottages now


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## embe

yacorie said:


> ...when I first saw it - my thought was some type of mixing paddle - something that moved easier through liquid with those slats but who knows...



First thought that came to my mind as well.  Mixing maple syrup maybe, eh?  

Now that it's out of the water it'll probably oxidize (rust) pretty quick


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## RCO

embe said:


> First thought that came to my mind as well.  Mixing maple syrup maybe, eh?
> 
> Now that it's out of the water it'll probably oxidize (rust) pretty quick



yeah I noticed that after I took that picture its started to dry off a bit and looks a bit different in terms of colour / rust 

there was obviously a maple syrup industry here , not sure if it could possibly be connected to that 

the area near where it was found also had a lakefront store , hotel , boat builders , marina


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## RCO

willong said:


> I generally get a kick out of these "what is it" teasers. This is one where I sincerely hope someone comes up with a definitive answer as I am just going with my best two, minimally-educated guesses. If the "blade" or "spoon" portion of the implement is significantly cupped (it's hard to tell in the plan view), then I think that CanadianBottles is on the right track--it is likely the bit of an ice auger. If instead, that blade portion is relatively flat, then I think it might be a bark spud (tool for peeling logs). The through-slots are a bit baffling in either case. The handle ferrule on a bark spud is often kicked up from the plane of the blade, like most shovels, on the order of 15-degrees; but that is not always the case.




I've been poking around at that location with metal magnet since 2019 but been swimming there since 2014 for bottles and found various soda's and milks there 

most of the metal items I've pulled out so far didn't appear that old , is some nails or bolts which appear older 

but its been a fairly busy dock area for a long time , so likely older items down there . the spot where I pulled it out would of been the very end of a long since removed dock . 

so a good chance it had been on a boat or on the dock and fell in the water


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## willong

RCO said:


> there was obviously a maple syrup industry here , not sure if it could possibly be connected to that
> 
> the area near where it was found also had a lakefront store , hotel , boat builders , marina



Sounds like a neat area.


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## willong

RCO said:


> I've been poking around at that location with metal magnet since 2019 but been swimming there since 2014 for bottles and found various soda's and milks there
> 
> most of the metal items I've pulled out so far didn't appear that old , is some nails or bolts which appear older
> 
> but its been a fairly busy dock area for a long time , so likely older items down there . the spot where I pulled it out would of been the very end of a long since removed dock .
> 
> so a good chance it had been on a boat or on the dock and fell in the water



Been thinking about this mystery item a little more and another thought came to mind. Was the water approximately 12' or more deep where you found it?  Are there many reedy shallows on the lake; or in channels connecting to other lakes? Was it ever a popular place for waterfowl hunting or fishing for Northern pike or Muskellunge?

The slots in the blade portion of the item don't make much sense to me for the other proposed uses (bark spud or ice auger). However, suppose another "blade" fitted into the slots so that the two together formed something like a duck's bill. Might it be an antique, cast iron version of this:




Pictured item is a modern push pole for propelling boats, typically through shallow and weedy areas, by poling.


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## Newfie treasure hunter

RCO said:


> found off a dock in a fresh water lake in Ontario Canada , not near an ocean . never been a commercial fishery there either
> 
> is a lot of boats there , seen pictures from the past and that area was filled with wooden boats , canoes etc
> 
> was a lot of logging here , during the winter was people who removed bricks of ice from the lakes to ship to other places


My first thought was an ice breaker. Would have been on a long handle and would've been used almost like a walking stick. No idea if Im correct


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## RCO

willong said:


> Been thinking about this mystery item a little more and another thought came to mind. Was the water approximately 12' or more deep where you found it?  Are there many reedy shallows on the lake; or in channels connecting to other lakes? Was it ever a popular place for waterfowl hunting or fishing for Northern pike or Muskellunge?
> 
> The slots in the blade portion of the item don't make much sense to me for the other proposed uses (bark spud or ice auger). However, suppose another "blade" fitted into the slots so that the two together formed something like a duck's bill. Might it be an antique, cast iron version of this:
> View attachment 225472
> Pictured item is a modern push pole for propelling boats, typically through shallow and weedy areas, by poling.



there is still pike and muskee in that lake , I'd imagine people hunted ducks on it years ago  . 

I wondered if it could of been used on a boat somehow 

there was a mysterious boat builder in that area who made propelling boats , I don't know a lot about them but would of been there around the 20's or a bit earlier 

pictures of those docks show a lot of older wooden boats , canoes etc , so many boats in that area back then


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## Harry Pristis

yacorie said:


> when I first saw it - my thought was some type of mixing paddle - something that moved easier through liquid with those slats but who knows.



*It's difficult for me to think of anything it could be other than a mixing paddle.  What would you boil in a large vessel in inland Ontario?  . . . Maple syrup?  . . . Laundry?  . . . Stew for the regiment?*


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## east texas terry

I have found a tool that looks like it in the early 1900 turpentine camp in  East Texas


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## Toma777

I'd say a Barnacle Scraper or Mixing Paddle, and I'm leaning more towards a Mixing Paddle.

I have an ice scraper tool that looks a bit like that for scraping ice off of cement.


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## willong

east texas terry said:


> I have found a tool that looks like it in the early 1900 turpentine camp in East Texas



Well, since turpentine is another product produced from boiled sap, I say that adds credence to the mixing paddle theory.

On the other hand, one method of obtaining the sap that is to be distilled is to slash the trees' bark in a V pattern to produce a scar where the sap will collect (similar to collecting natural rubber latex). So, that brings up the possibility of a bark spud again. 








						Turpentine - Wikipedia
					






					en.wikipedia.org
				




I would look in Sloane's "_Early American Tools_" if I had any idea where my copy got to. Still hoping someone can come up with a definite, documented answer.


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## RCO

Harry Pristis said:


> *It's difficult for me to think of anything it could be other than a mixing paddle.  What would you boil in a large vessel in inland Ontario?  . . . Maple syrup?  . . . Laundry?  . . . Stew for the regiment?*



I like the mixing paddle theory , its fairly heavy though but if you had a big enough handle 

another large industry here in the early 1900's was tanneries , wasn't one at that lake / area but was a lot of logging to support them . they logged " hemlock " trees and bark for use in them


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## willong

RCO said:


> another large industry here in the early 1900's was tanneries , wasn't one at that lake / area but was a lot of logging to support them . they logged " hemlock " trees and bark for use in them



Sounds like another reason to suspect it is a bark spud, but the through-slots still puzzle me. They would, IMO, simply weaken the tool if that was its purpose. 

Is there any bevel to the edge to indicate that it was ever sharpened like either an ice chopping tool or bark spud would have been?


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## SandiR

RCO said:


> found this off a dock using a metal magnet , the dock has been there since 1870's . its been a busy location for some time so I had a hard time determining what this item was or when its from .
> 
> it appeared to have been down there for a long time , as its very dirty and dark black coloured . size is around 4 or 5 " wide and 7 or 8 " long
> 
> not exactly sure what it is ? appears to have had a handle or attached to something . not much of a tool person so not able to id it any further .
> 
> View attachment 225439View attachment 225440


It could be a mash paddle used in brewing.


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## RCO

willong said:


> Sounds like another reason to suspect it is a bark spud, but the through-slots still puzzle me. They would, IMO, simply weaken the tool if that was its purpose.
> 
> Is there any bevel to the edge to indicate that it was ever sharpened like either an ice chopping tool or bark spud would have been?




doesn't appear to have been sharpened but in its current condition , hard to say for sure 

its most likely related to one of our local industries of the past which mostly seem to be - logging , boat building , tanneries 

that lake has never had a significant agricultural presence or fishery on it


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## embe

Ask one of the other locals, they might know...or know somebody, who knows somebody, that knows.  Might even recognize it right off the bat


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## Bohdan

RCO said:


> found this off a dock using a metal magnet , the dock has been there since 1870's . its been a busy location for some time so I had a hard time determining what this item was or when its from .
> 
> it appeared to have been down there for a long time , as its very dirty and dark black coloured . size is around 4 or 5 " wide and 7 or 8 " long
> 
> not exactly sure what it is ? appears to have had a handle or attached to something . not much of a tool person so not able to id it any further .
> 
> View attachment 225439View attachment 225440


You don't say how heavy/thick it is
Egg/pancake flipper.


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## RCO

Bohdan said:


> You don't say how heavy/thick it is
> Egg/pancake flipper.



its heavy cast iron , it does look similar to a modern cooking flipper but seems way too heavy and not flat , has a curve


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## jarhead67

I was going to say a spatula or grilling flipper, but the curve throws that out. Weight and cast iron wasn't uncommon for most things back then and it could be a restaurant or commercial item. Fun to quiz over.


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## embe

Is it for scooping hot rocks?  If you had an outdoor fire, you could scoop the hot rocks into a metal container and bring them inside to heat a small camp (without the smoke or ashes) burning the camp down.  The scoop would retain the rocks while the hot ashes would remain in the outdoor pit.  I like quizzes too


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