# COCA COLA BOTTLE "CAP" - (Help w/ID-Date)



## SODAPOPBOB (Apr 23, 2010)

The photo below is of an early Coca Cola bottle cap I have - and one which I have been attempting to date and/or identify. The image is a little blurry - and it reads as follows from top to bottom ...

                                               MINIMUM CONTENTS
                                                                6
                                                       FLUID OZS
                                                     COCA COLA
                                                REG. U.S. PAT OFF
                                           COLORED WITH CARMEL
                                          CRASS COCA COLA BOT'G
                                                         PLANTS
                                                   RICHMOND, VA.
                    (Unseen in the photo - On the side of the cap is the number 8)

 I always try and do my research first, but this particular cap has me stumped. Following this first page will be a couple of others with additional photos to help better illustrate the full nature of this query.

                                        Thanks in advance to all who reply.

                                                     SODAPOPBOB

 MY CAP


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## SODAPOPBOB (Apr 23, 2010)

Circa 1911 cap - Amber Root Bottle


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## SODAPOPBOB (Apr 23, 2010)

Circa 1915 Cap - Hobbleskirt Bottle


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## SODAPOPBOB (Apr 23, 2010)

Circa 1923 Cap - Hobbleskirt Bottle


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## OsiaBoyce (Apr 23, 2010)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tY5x8pF512k

 Early 30s


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## SODAPOPBOB (Apr 23, 2010)

Please Note : I have determined that the Richmond, VA. plant opened around 1907. And that because it has "Minimum Contents" on it, it would date it around 1914 or later.

                                                  My questions are as follows ...

                                       1.   What does the word "CASS" refer to?
                                       2.   What year was this cap produced?
                                       3.   What does the number 8 represent?

 If you have the answers to my questions, or any other info about this subject you would like to share, please let me know.

 Thanks again,

 SPB


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## digdug (Apr 23, 2010)

The 'Crass' on the cap refers to a Family (Last name Crass) that owned around 40 different Coca-Cola bottling plants in Virginia, West Virginia and I think Maryland.  Try to do a search at google  on Crass Coca-Cola, something should come up.


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## SODAPOPBOB (Apr 23, 2010)

OsiaBoyce ~

 Thank you for the response - but I need to ask if you are sure about the early 1930s date?  Although I don't have an exact chronological photo file on Coca Cola caps, everything I have seen "so far" from the 1930s look like the one shown below.

 digdug ~

 Thanks. I Googled the name but so far didn't find what I was looking for. But I intend to check again.


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## SODAPOPBOB (Apr 23, 2010)

I've looked at so many Coca Cola bottle caps my eyes are going blurry. But I cannot find anything quite like the one in question here. Regarding the 1930s examples, I keep coming up with images like the one in this magazine ad from December of 1932.

 Most of what I have seen so far have a silverish/gray looking backgrounds. But mine has a tannish/beigh background.

 Its no big deal really. I was just wondering if it was possible to determine if it came from a straight-sided bottle, or a Hobbleskirt?

 Thanks again,

 SPB


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## OsiaBoyce (Apr 23, 2010)

I'm purty sure of it. See the one top left? Same thing sans the xtra info. Oldest I got. There's somebody out there that can tell you the exact date, I can't, but I know where to find them.


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## OsiaBoyce (Apr 23, 2010)

Here's a few more. A standard for caps was not  set in stone for bottlers. I got a couple of htf 55's around here somewhere that's unique to Coke caps.

  I'll look for em in a bit.


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## SODAPOPBOB (Apr 23, 2010)

OsiaBoyce ~

 Thanks. I really appreciate the help.

 Another thing that's confusing me is in regards to the "Minimun Contents" aspect to all of this.

 I know the "Gould Amendment" that was added to the U.S. Food & Drug Act of 1906, states that all food and drug containers were required to show the "contents" information somewhere easily visible on the containers. And that the deadline or grace period for this new law ended in 1914. And yet I keep seeing straight-sided Coca Cola bottles that are dated circa 1911-1913, etc; but the caps already have the 6 oz contents info on them. So does this mean that Coca Cola voluntarily put this info on their bottle "caps" in advance of the 1914 deadline? And if so, then why don't the pre-1914 bottles themselves also have this information embossed on them? 

                               I hope this isn't too many questions, as I have one more ...

 Does anyone have a "for sure" 1905-1910 straight-sided Coca-Cola bottle with the cap still on it? And if so, could you please share a photo of it for us?  (actually, that's "two" questions).  []

 Thanks a million,

 SPB


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## SODAPOPBOB (Apr 23, 2010)

Hey Morb!  Where are you?  I hope you see this and can tell us something about the "Cass" operated Coca Cola bottling plants in Virginia. I checked your website and didn't see anything connected with the Richmond bottlers. The only thing I came up with so far was that the Cass family operated several plants, and that a date of 1907 was somehow connected. I Googled every combination of "Cass Coca Cola Bottler Richmond Virgina" that I could think of, but found very little, and certainly nothing specific.

 I contacted Bill Porter, and even he admits he doesn't know that much about bottle caps, and even less about the Cass family bottling operations of Virginia.. 

                                 To reiterate :  I'm trying to determine the following ...

 1.   To date my cap as close as possible.
 2.   To determine why the contents information is on pre-1914* Coca Cola bottle "caps."
 3.   To find out some specific information on the "Cass" bottling operation(s) in Virginia.
 4.   To see if anyone has a photo of a 1900 to 1905 Coca Cola bottle cap. 

                                * (The Gould amendment / law deadline was 1914).

 Thanks again to all,

 SPB


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## SODAPOPBOB (Apr 23, 2010)

P.S. ~

 In my last post I just realized I misspelled Crass. (Cass) But my searches were all done under "Crass." 

 SPB


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## OsiaBoyce (Apr 23, 2010)

Here's a little help for ya or get you going in the right direction.

http://www.bottlecapclub.org/


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## SODAPOPBOB (Apr 23, 2010)

OsiaBoyce ~

 Thanks again - seriously. But I spent about a half hour on that very site earlier today, but still did not come up with anything of real help. If you found something there please let me know. I don't want to send them a e-mail inquiry just yet. That would be too easy. Plus, for the time being I prefer to keep this in the A-B.net family. Much more fun that way!

 And your timing is just right, because my brother from Idaho just sent me the following ... So I guess I can scratch Q.# 3 off of my list.

 SPB

                                                                      ~ * ~

 James E. Crass (1867-1930), was born in Mayfield, Kentucky, and founded the predecessor franchise group to the Central Coca-Cola Company, Inc. Orphaned at an early age Crass was sent to live with an older half-brother, John T. Crass, a contractor in Chattanooga, Tennessee. His brother built the Lookout Incline and Lula Lake Railway in the late 1890s in Chattanooga. When of age, James E. Crass worked for his brother as an agent for a new cable line in the area. Crass saved money from his jobs and at the urging of Asa G. Candler, owner of The Coca-Cola Company, he purchased a small Coca-Cola bottling plant in Charleston, South Carolina in 1899. Within the next year Crass quickly outgrew the small plant and moved to Richmond, Virginia to build a larger plant in a more expansive bottling territory. Syrup in his territory was acquired from the Coca-Cola Company (Thomas) of Chattanooga, Tennessee who held the exclusive rights to sell the syrup to other bottlers in Crassâ€™s area. Crass grew his Coca-Cola conglomeration into 42 franchises in Virginia, Ohio, and Pennsylvania among other states. James E. Crass was married to the former Emma Leimenstoll of Ohio. They had four children: James Edward, Lottie, Ada, and Nellie. At the time of his death in 1930, Crass was one of the most successful owners in the Coca-Cola franchise network and even produced his own brand of soda. In preparation for the future of the company Crass had taken on his son-in-law, and former Coca-Cola Company sales manager, as an employee. Walter L. Sams took over the management of the Crass plants upon Mr. Crassâ€™s death.


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## RED Matthews (Apr 24, 2010)

HI SODAPOPBOB, & OsiaBoyce,  I am working on my wifes computer because my harddrive crashed. 
 Anyway, I have a large Coca-Cola Glass Advertiseing Bottle that needs a Crown Cap.  The cap will have to fit a 1" top crown finish, preferaly with Coca-Cola on it.  The bottle measures 19-3/4" high, with a shoulder bulge of 6" an the same base diameter - Hobble Skirt Design with the ACL "/ Coca-Cola " on one sied  and "/ Coke " on the back.  
 I have no clue as to how common these are, but it is the only one I know of.  
 I hope to be back in business in a few days.  RED Matthews


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## SODAPOPBOB (Apr 24, 2010)

Hey Red!  Where ya been?  I was looking for you the other day. I was hoping you could take a look at my thread on early "Crown-Top" soda bottles, and was hoping with your expertise with bottle molds that you might have some input on the subject.

 Speaking now of your "Huge" Coke bottle, I saw one of those last week at an antique show. But this one had Coca Cola in script on both sides. However, it didn't have a cap like the one you are looking for. The seller was asking $200.00 for the bottle itself. I imagine those accompanying caps are pretty hard to come by, and I will definitely keep my eyes peeled for one.

 Thanks again,

 SPB


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## fanboy (Apr 26, 2010)

Have you explored when "US Pat Reg" started use? I can not find it at the moment, but I have the feeling it started in the 40's and earlier you would see "Trademark Registered" on items.

 The full bottles at the top I think are recaps, also the 1915 and 1923 show the exact same cap, even the same scratch...

 Chris


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## SODAPOPBOB (Apr 26, 2010)

fanboy ~

 Good eye - good observations.

 I didn't catch the same scratch part. But I did wonder why the closeups of the bottles were empty instead of with contents as shown in the full image. And now that I have taken a second look at things, I'm sure the photos of both caps and both full bottles are the same photos. You will notice the 1915 photos are bright and focused, where the 1923 is duller and slightly fuzzy. For whatever reason they used the same photos for both bottles and only changed the closeups of the empties. And as for the "Reg. U.S. Pat. Off.," I'm confident it refers to the Coca Cola name itself, and not the bottle or the cap. And I totally understand what you mean by the actual wording difference, but I'm not sure if it's possible to differentiate if/when the two options were used, other than from old magazine ads and/or close examinations of other Coca Cola items. At your suggestion I intend to take a closer look into this, but I have a feeling I'm going to discover multiple variations of the wording throughout the entire course of Coca Cola merchandising. But until I look, I can't say for certain.

 It could boil down to the fact there were no rules regarding caps, (especially in the early days), and that each individual bottler did whatever they wanted, (within reason). And if this is the case, I may never be able to date it. About all I can say for sure is that of the dozens and dozens of Coca Cola caps I have found images of, I have yet to see a single one like mine. Nor have I seen one yet that is made of gold colored metal like mine. All that I have seen so far are silverish/gray metal. 

 I'm not the type of individual who gets carried away with wishful thinking, nor do I try to date something earlier than it is - it's just a bottle cap and no big deal - and yet my gut instinct, plus 30 years of collecting tells me my cap is pre-1920, and possibly even pre-1917 which is when the hobbleskirt finally went into full circulation. I honestly believe it came from a very early, straight sided bottle.

 You'd think it would be a simple thing to determine what Coca Cola's first crown cap looked like. But it's starting to look as if it's as difficult as determining what their very first crown bottle looked like. Two mysteries in one!

 Thanks again. You've been a great help. And welcome to the club.

 SPB


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## SODAPOPBOB (Apr 26, 2010)

Perhaps the photo below will better illustrate my query. The one on the left is the cap in question, compared to the one on the right which is obviously different. My camera is not the best, nor am I the best photographer, but you should be able to see difference in the gold metal vs. the silver metal. But even more interesting is the Coca Cola "Spencerian" script on the cap on the left. Notice that it is of a slightly less-uniformed style, and appears older. And especially notice the "tail" on the capital "C" in the word Cola. I have read of this "wider tail" referred to as Coca Cola's older "Fish Tail" design, and that it was only used in the early days. After a period of time, (date unknown), they inaugurated a more uniformed look (like the one on the right), that was eventually "required" throughout the entire Coca Cola industry.

 So now you know as much about my cap as I do, which really isn't all that much. But I suppose only with more research will I ever be able to date it accurately. And at this point I would even settle for an approximate date. But are we talking about circa 1900-1905, circa 1905-1910, circa 1910-1920 or circa 1920-1930? 

 No big deal, I guess ... but I would sure like to know just for the heck of it.

 Thanks,

 SPB


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## fanboy (Apr 26, 2010)

I must admit, most of my experience is with Canadian Coca Cola caps. There should be fairly strong similarities to US caps.

 The only full SS bottle I have, the cap is covered in fine rust and there is no visible print. At that; I can not guarantee it wasn't filled in the 60's or 70's. I do have 1 other SS that was definitly refilled in the 60's.

 I personally feel your cap is likely 1940's. That is based on the apparent thinness of the cap, the color of the printing and the reasonably centered printing.

 I have many Canadian caps, including what I believe to be a pre-1915 cap, many later and most importantly a Winnipeg Headquarters cap. Winnipeg was the headquarters for Coca Cola Company of Canada between 1915 and 1923; before and after it was Toronto. This gives me a very good reference for a cap of this period. The printing is off center, and the cap when compared to a later cap; the flange is noticeably larger. The pre-1915 is also larger and the printing is offset by about 10-15%.

 It is my feeling if you had 1930-1950's caps next to this one, it would litterly stand out like a sore thumb, as it is that different.

 I will try to take a picture to illustrate later...

 Good luck with the hunt!
 Chris


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## SODAPOPBOB (Apr 26, 2010)

I just spent the last hour or so conducting what I call a "forensic" study of the Coca Cola signature. I am saddened to report I could find no specifics regarding the subtile changes to the signature over the years. I looked at literally hundreds of magazine ads starting with 1904 through about 1950. And about the only thing I discovered is it "appears" they finally got their act together and became considerably more uniformed sometime in the mid to late 1920s. But prior to this approximate date things are all over the place with no real rhyme or reason to them. 

 So with that said, I  may have to give up the search unless someone just happens to have a "still capped" bottle in their collection with my exact style of cap still on it. And should one of these elusive bottles ever turn up, I'll bet you an ice cold bottle of Coke that the cap went to a straight-sided bottle.

 Please prove me wrong. There is nothing I'd rather do than  ... "Buy The World A Coke."  []

 Sincerely,

 Dr. Bob  [8|]


 P.S.  Chris ~ ...  Thanks. You were posting while I was typing. And you are probably right. I just wish there was some simple method of knowing for sure. I am totally open minded to anything and everything you have to contribute.  "Obi-Wan Kanobi, you are my last hope!"  []


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## SODAPOPBOB (Apr 26, 2010)

P.S. ~ P.S.

 Please don't yell at me, but I changed my "opinion" from straight-sided bottle to "PRE-1920." And will stand by it this time! But I am still back to my original question ... How in the heck do I "prove" it? 

 Thanks a million,

 Bob


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## OsiaBoyce (Apr 26, 2010)

What makes you say this 1930s cap is pre 1920.
http://www.bottlecapclub.org/

 See the one top right, that's a 1923. Look like yours?


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## OsiaBoyce (Apr 26, 2010)

Bob, I ask a dealer and collector of crown caps that I deal w/what year this was and,........................1928-35. Sorry, but that's the way it is. 

 If you wanna ask him, you can find him on ebay as "cogp15t" he'll answer any question you may have.


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## SODAPOPBOB (Apr 27, 2010)

OsiaBoyce ~

 First of all ... Thank you. I am glad you were able to date my cap. That was exactly what this thread was intended for. You were right all along. 1928-1935 totally works for me.That would definitely make it a hobbleskirt bottle, and likely from Virginia.

 The reason I thought it was pre-1920, is because that's what the seller at the bottle show told me three years ago when I bought it. I only paid $2.00 for it, so I just tossed in in a bowl with about 50 other caps and forget about it. But when the earthquake knocked the bowl off the shelf, I picked it up off the floor and remembered it. And that's when I got to think'n about the 1920 date, and just got curious because I really couldn't confirm it on my own. Thus, I came to Antique-Bottles.net and found the answer. I was prejudiced in the begining because of what the seller told me. But I now stand corrected thanks to y'all, and especially ... OsiaBoyce ... you know him, he's the guy who works for O.S.I.A. and goes around inspecting saftey in work places.  He sure did a good job here.   []

 fanboy ~

 Right on, man! You brought this whole thing to the surface. I was ready to let it sink until you came along and threw me a life preserver to keep from drowning.  D'ya want to buy a 1930-something Coca Cola bottle cap?  I got one. I'll let you have it for $5.00 ... oh, wait! I almost forgot. I owe you a ice cold Coke. Cool with me ... but'ja gotta come to So Cal to get it. Let me know when you're coming.

 Seriously,

 Thanks to one for all & all for one.

 SODAPOPBOB


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## SODAPOPBOB (Apr 27, 2010)

OsiaBoyce ~

 I didn't mention this earlier because I wanted to experiment with it first. But that bottle cap link you provided is giving me some problems. Or maybe it's just me. Anyway, when you open the link it goes straight to their home page, and then from there it's necessary to do a search. Except everytime I put something into their search program it doesn't work. The only thing I've been able to do so far is start with the "A's" and then scroll page by page alphabetically until I get to where I want. But this takes forever. What am I doing wrong?  Is there an easier way to go straight to the Coke caps? I'm usually pretty good at this stuff, but this one has me temporarily stumped.

 Thanks again,

 Bob

 P.S.  Another reason I thought my cap was 1920s is because prior to posting my query here I did some seperate research and every cap I came across for the 1930s looked like the one below that is from e-Bay. In fact, this particular one just closed. The link below should still work. (At least it did when I tested it a minute ago). And if it opens like it should, you'll see where the seller is referring to this cap as 1930. Which looks nothing like mine. So you can see one of the reasons for my confusion about the date. 

 SPB

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=290427007312&ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT


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## SODAPOPBOB (Apr 27, 2010)

OsiaBoyce ~

 I finally figured out that bottle cap website. (It was me who was messing up). You have to go to the "Quick Search" and then enter your preference at "the very top" of the box. 

 Plus here's the link that I believe you intended for us to look at earlier with the 1923 cap in the upper right. I would attach a photo of it but it's in a "bmp" format that won't work here unless it's converted to "jpeg," which I have been unable to do so far. Anyway, you're right, it looks nothing like mine.

http://www.bottlecapclub.org/

 Thanks,

 SPB


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## SODAPOPBOB (Apr 27, 2010)

I'm just messing around here and thought I would try that image again of the 1923 Coca Cola bottle cap. I was finally able to convert it.

 SPB


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## SODAPOPBOB (Apr 27, 2010)

And as long as I'm at it, and for a future reference, I thought I would post this image of a 1906-1913 cap ... which is what I thought the date of mine was in the beginning. Notice how the "O's" don't have the "open loop" at the top. I read about this somewhere in my research, but it was kind of confusing at the time. 

 SPB


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## T D (Apr 27, 2010)

..               ..
                        ..           ..
                        [:-]      [:-]


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## SODAPOPBOB (Apr 28, 2010)

> Have you explored when "US Pat Reg" started use? I can not find it at the moment, but I have the feeling it started in the 40's and earlier you would see "Trademark Registered" on items.


 
 fanboy ~

 Regarding you question from earlier (which I pasted above), it got me to thinking about this, so I did a little research. And although I have not found anything specific yet involving the dates as to when the various trademark wordings were used, I wanted to check and see if you came across anything?  I'm working on another research project and the information you suggested looking for would be of a great help to me. Please let me know if you find anything. But overall it appears that trademark information placed on items is more of a protection of rights than it is of any form of a requirement.

 Thanks again,

 SPB

 I found this pertaining to Coca Cola that may be of interest. You probably know that Coca Cola was first developed in 1886. So it's possible there were a few years when the name was wide open for anybody to patent and use, and possibly even to steal. ?   






 Coca-Cola is a registered trademark in most countries. The U.S. trademark for "Coca-Cola" was first filed on May 14, 1892 with the description "nutrient or tonic beverages". This filing became a registered United States trademark on January 31, 1893 and continues to be renewed. [/align]


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## OldCokeMan (Oct 3, 2022)

SODAPOPBOB said:


> OsiaBoyce ~
> 
> Thanks. I really appreciate the help.
> 
> ...


Hi, I do have a 1905-10 Roanoke ,Va Amber coke cap that I will post, still on bottle found under old building…it will take me a few days to get it up..the cap I have has no contents and the bottler and state around perimeter of cap


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## OldCokeMan (Oct 3, 2022)

OldCokeMan said:


> Hi, I do have a 1905-10 Roanoke ,Va Amber coke cap that I will post, still on bottle found under old building…it will take me a few days to get it up..the cap I have has no contents and the bottler and state around perimeter of cap


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## OldCokeMan (Oct 3, 2022)

1905 Coca-Cola cap. Roanoke Va around perimeter


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## M.C.Glass (Oct 9, 2022)

That cap looks a little more modern than 1905-1910. Maybe mid 1950s. Just my opinion.


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