# Ball Improved Quart , Quad Helix



## jaroadshow (May 4, 2013)

Hi : I recently found about 10 old jars I wanted to keep, in an old adandoned farm house north east of London , Ont. The basement was covered with bottles and mostly jars. Also had jars on shelves that still had old fruit in them.  I will post a picture of the Ball jar but will post the other pictures later, but the question I have is one of the jars my son and I found is a beautiful amethyst quart Ball improved with the dropped "A" in Ball and a dropped "R" in improved and the jar has the quad helix.
 The jar is mint and beautiful. Does anyone know the rarity and value ?
 One of the nicer  jars also was a Canadian quart STAR in clear ( ground mouth ). ( normal "R" in STAR )

 Thanks

 jaroadshow
 London , Ont.


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## jaroadshow (May 4, 2013)

Hi : I forgot to mention that the embossing on my Ball Improved jar is the thickest, highest embossing I have seen on any old bottle.

 I don't know why this is  but it adds to the beauty.

 jaroadshow


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## dygger60 (May 6, 2013)

Very nice jar.....gotta love the sun colored glass...

    I would not say it is rare, but, it is valued high amoung Ball Brother jar collectors or someone that specializes in the Ball Improved line....

    with a nice matching glass insert and correct band, it is a keeper...it is a keeper now actually... it dates to the early years of the dropped "A" logo...right before or right after the turn of the century. Giving to how old the Improved line was at the date of logo change, pre 1900, I would feel safe in saying.

     Worth, well that is a matter between buyer and seller. As is now, maybe $15 USD.  But some would not go that high with the lid missing. But if it is in as good of shape as you mentioned...I would over look the missing lid and get it for later matching.


     David


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## ajohn (May 6, 2013)

Nice jar, I love that sun colored effect! 
     BUT... I in need of some schoolin. ( and not fer my spellin)
   Quad helix????? what does that term refer to on this jar?? Thankx A.J.


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## dygger60 (May 7, 2013)

Back in the days...the helix refered to were lines used to align the two halfs of molds in the machine...some have a double helix and some have a quad (4) helix....they are usually found on the early machine made jars..such as the IMPROVED and the SURE SEAL lines...

    I am in the process of moving, but about 15 or so years ago an article was written for the FJN,,,Fruit Jar Newsletter...when I am unpacked I will dig through my editions and find the article.....it was written by the late Dick Roller...great article...



    David


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## RED Matthews (May 7, 2013)

To all and anyone that can help.  I would like to read about this reference regarding â€œDouble and Quad Helix marksâ€.  This is a new one for me.  

 I am familiar with Pins and Dowels,  Tonge and Groove, and Dove Tail  mold allignment configurations.

 RED Matthews


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## cowseatmaize (May 7, 2013)

It was for me too Red. Here's a link.
 http://balljarcollectorscommunitycenter.yuku.com/topic/730/What-is-a-QUAD-Helix-

 I guess instead of a continuous thread it's either two of four separate threads on the same lip.


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## zecritr (May 7, 2013)

cool info thx for the link 
 now
 I would like to see the quad helix on this jar up top  plz


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## cowseatmaize (May 7, 2013)

Those Ball folk deserve some kudo's. I would never have guessed it was for part of the machining if I saw one. I would have been looking for a matching lid.


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## jaroadshow (May 7, 2013)

Hi : Can anyone show me a picture of the correct lid for this jar ?

 Thanks

 jaroadshow


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## coreya (May 7, 2013)

its hard to tell from the angle of your picture but it may be a glass top and zinc band sort of like this,







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## RED Matthews (May 9, 2013)

Hello all Ball collectors.  This link solved the confusion for me, to some extent.  The pictures show the threaded finish and it also shows a tool line projecting up on the outside surface of the molded neckring part of the finish.  
 The thread grooves were milled in the neckrings main bore, this shows that the milling cutter left a spiraling track up the inner bore of the neckring as it was removed from the thread cutting work.  
 It didnâ€™t happen in our mold shop with the earliest method we used, and after we went to the Kelley Thread Cutting machine â€“ it didnâ€™t happen.  I doubt if my old friend Bob Davis in the Mold Division of Ball is still going â€“ but I will try today to see if he is.  He would know what they used to thread the neckrings back then.

 The problem didnâ€™t have anything to do with the sealing, so it wouldnâ€™t have any thing to do with which glass cap or cap ring was used.

 The main thought is that it had nothing to do with the operation of the glass bottles performance.   RED Matthews


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## ajohn (May 9, 2013)

Boy am I glad I asked that question!!! Thanks you guys fer the imfo. you guys are great!


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