# Not bottles but...



## Gunsmoke47 (Apr 2, 2005)

If I'm not diggin bottles, I'm diggin military artifacts, if I'm not diggin military artifacts, I'm diggin Indian artifacts, but I'm always lookin for all three. I got lucky today.  Happy Diggin,  Kelley[]


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## redbrass_ca (Apr 17, 2005)

Very nice Indian Artifacts.  They look like they are made of flint.  Are they common in your area .  I am sure this stuff must fetch a few $$$

 All the best

 Thierry G. Papion


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## bearswede (Apr 17, 2005)

Hi Kelly...

 Ron here...

 As an archeologist (in a former life) I'm conflicted enuff about digging bottles without context... But it seems to me anyway, that when it comes to native american sites, it's best to collect from areas already disturbed, such as plowed fields, gardens or any construction site... Then, after documenting your artifacts, report the sites to the state archeologist or the nearest university or museum... Also, selling indian artifacts tends to encourage the further destruction of sites...

 We have written records of our own 18th, 19th and 20th centuries, so the bottle dumps we dig wouldn't yield such essential information compared to cultures with little or no written history... And artifacts without the context they were derived from are almost useless for analizing prehistory...

 Just something to mull over...

 Bear


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## tazmainiendigger (Apr 17, 2005)

Good score Kelley! Are they bird points? Taz


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## Gunsmoke47 (Apr 18, 2005)

Hey *Thierry*,  yes they are quite common throughout Texas. These particular points date late prehistoric 500 AD- 1500 AD. They are Alibeits flint with the only known quarry about 45 miles from where I live. Some points will fetch into the thousands but these would probably only be worth $15.00- $25.00.

*Ron*, how about sticking out of the bank of a county road?  This particular camp is very large with the road going through the middle of it. The Texas State Historical Commission Archeologist (with whom I have worked with before) has already been notified and we are awaiting land owners permission to do an indepth state funded excavation. If this site pans out to be what we expect, it will be the farthest South  these particular plains farming people have been recorded.  Don't want you to think I'm one of those sub human forms that just wants to rape the land to make a buck.[]  PS. I'm also on the board of directors at our musuem here.[]

*Taz*, Thanks buddy. The one on the left is just a scraper, the one on top is called a Harrell, and the one on bottom had the base broken off but I believe it was a Triangle.


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## bearswede (Apr 18, 2005)

Glad to hear you're deeply involved with the scientific community, Kelly...

 About the point on the top right... To me it looks more like a Washita-Peno with a basal concavity rather than a basal notch found in the Harrell type... That would give it a slightly narrower chronological range within the Mississippian (800-400 BP)...

 Ron


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## Gunsmoke47 (Apr 18, 2005)

Could be Ron,  my knowledge of points leaves much to be desired. The (800-400 BP) would be the era we believe and hope this camp to be. Washitas abound in this area. If this turns out to be what we hope, it will be approximately 75 miles farther South than any recorded camp to date.

 Through some research on the internet I have seen points with the base notch and without being called Harrells. Could this be a "tomato/tomotto" thing?  Kelley


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## bearswede (Apr 18, 2005)

Hi Kelly...

 Point typography, like bottle color, is pretty much a can o' worms, no doubt... I was using Overstreet's ID and Price Guide (given to me on my last birthday by some bottle buds)... Below is a scan... Yours looks most like G7 or an amalgam of G8 and G7...

 What do you think? Apparently, all these types have some kind of relationship to each other, but who really knows how to unravel what's function vs. what's style or whatever else was driving how projectile points were fashioned in prehistory?

 Fun stuff, tho...

 Ron


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## Gunsmoke47 (Apr 18, 2005)

Hey Ron.... Yup, looks just like a cross between both G7 and G8 Washita Alibates to me. Whatever they are, there will be a whole lot more artifacts before it is over (providing the land owner cooperates). Lots of bone and pottery sherds laying about as well. Looking real forward to this one. I will keep you informed.  Happy Diggin,  Kelley []


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## Pettydigger (Apr 18, 2005)

Ahhh......Native American artifacts, my other hobby I've had since I was 5 years old walking streams and fields with my dad. If I get started on rocks I will have to make my own web site tonight[]Nice couple bird points Gunsmoke47!
 Josh


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## diginit (Apr 22, 2005)

Thanks for peaking my couriosity. The Olone indians were in the areas I explore for thousands of years before us. Now if I find any pre-written history artifacts, I know what to do. Then I'll post the pics.


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## BRIAN S. (Apr 22, 2005)

We find the points here in Tennessee in the freshly plowed fields in the valleys .
 I would hit the fields every Spring after the first rain. I had 700 near perfect points at one time.... all found in one field ( and a large ice chest full of broken ones). I found several fluted points......but all were broken. The Indians must have stayed in this area for many , many moons ! 
 I wish I had my points back.....But I was young and thought a Motorcycle was more important , so I sold most of them . KIDS !!!! 
 Brian


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## BARQS19 (Apr 23, 2005)

I've got boxes of this stuff, this was just the neatest thing I had that I was able to grap real quick.  It is a spear point (one on the right) and was found on one of the barrier islands in the gulf, not sure how it got there. As for the trade beads, they were found when the city was digging out a part of the creek.
 Robert


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