# Horse bones



## randgrithr (Mar 23, 2011)

I've found bones at most of the TOC dumps I dig, but they were associated with food - beef, pork, chicken. This one I am pretty sure is a femur from a horse. No glass found yet except for some tantalizing shards, but given that they haven't relied on horses around here for a while, I bet I am somewhere near serious pre-1903 paydirt. []


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## randgrithr (Mar 23, 2011)

Here's a molar I found near the femur. Wilbur didn't brush, but cut him a break - he's probably been dead for 150 years or so.


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## surfaceone (Mar 23, 2011)

Hey Eileen,

 I'm not too up on my faunal remains, though I do like to find odd bones and shells. The ends appear to be sawn, as if butchered, making me think "cow part." This is not to say that they weren't butchering some tasty horse meat, but probably more likely cow teeth.


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## randgrithr (Mar 23, 2011)

I would think it was a cow bone too, except that the tooth definitely looks more like a horse's, and the bone itself is very heavy for it's size. I've found "meat cut" cow bones before and they were nowhere near as heavy and thick as this.

 If they were burying a horse they might have cut it up first to keep from having to dig too big a hole. (Which would also explain why bones are coming up to the surface now.) I will be exploring that area more. One thing's for sure - Glen Cove was founded by early American industrialists - the Vanderbilts, Pratts, etc. This place stopped using horses for anything other than sport/entertainment much earlier than the rest of the country. And these bones are not new... so I think I am near something very good here, even if you're right and it's only a cow. Cows mean food, and food means bottles. []

 Eileen


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## old.s.bottles (Mar 25, 2011)

One of the first places I dug was a toc crawlspace, and I found either a horse or a cow skull...Why would they bury it there? That still is a mystery to me. Well, i suppose if they were eating it they might.


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## bostaurus (Mar 25, 2011)

A dog or some other critter may have dragged it there to eat in peace and quiet.  Disposal of an animal carcass has always been a problem.  Kind of hard to dig a pit big enough for a horse or a cow especially before backhoes.  It was easier to drag it to the woods and let nature have its way.  Not the best thing to do from a herd health standpoint but not much choice.  I think it is probably illegal to do that in most States nowadays.


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## farmgal (Mar 25, 2011)

Very cool Thread! Seeing all my digging is on our farm I have found a few bones/teeth. I didn't save them tho. And my dogs have dug up a few interesting things. I like Eileens thinking...cows mean food...food means bottles...Had a good laugh!! Farmgal


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## randgrithr (Mar 25, 2011)

Well I went out again today and found a dump layer in what was yet another creek bed. Lots of big clam and oyster shells, and coal. A few shards here and there, and then... another horse tooth! A front tooth this time. So I found a place to dig but the ground is still very hard yet. 

 I did unearth a shard that helped me date this area - a long necked brown bottle with an applied ground lip. Looked like a whiskey or other type liquor bottle. Dumps this old in my area do not usually yield a lot of whole glass, but when they do, there is great rejoicing! I am going to wait a while until the ground softens up some more before going back again.

 Eileen


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## surfaceone (Mar 26, 2011)

> I've found bones at most of the TOC dumps I dig, but they were associated with food - beef, pork, chicken. This one I am pretty sure is a femur from a horse.


 
 Hey Eileen,

 I gotta bone to pick with you. [8D]

 Why do you think this is not "associated" with food? How long is it? 6 or 8 inches? Just because it is a longer section of bone does not preclude beef. I've found all kinds of bone lengths and sizes while digging, cowparts every one. 

 I tried to find some definitive differences between horse teeth and cow teeth, but I ditched Biology for Dummies too much back in the day.

 Here's some horse teeth 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


From.




From. Can we determine the age of this horse? 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Here's some cow teeth 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 & some cow bones 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


From.

 Your tooth has that little nodule deal going a tad bit more than 1/2 way down the "crease" in that tooth, sure makes me think it looks like this cow tooth. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


From.



> I've found "meat cut" cow bones before and they were nowhere near as heavy and thick as this.


 What size are you talking about? Take a visit to the back room of your local butcher, and get back to me on this.

 Once upon a time there were rag & bone pickers.  
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 Now we have more professional bone pickers.  
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 I bet if you take yours to one of the latter, or the former, if you can find one, they'll call "cow."


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## bostaurus (Mar 26, 2011)

> Once upon a time there were rag & bone pickers


 The bones and even the rags, if unwearable, were used for fertilizer.  The rags back then were all from organic sources...linen, cotton, or wool.


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## surfaceone (Mar 26, 2011)

"Bone china is a type of porcelain that is composed of bone ash, feldspathic material and kaolin." From.


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## randgrithr (Mar 28, 2011)

Wow that is some calcium collection you have there SurfaceOne! It is quite possible there are horse and cow remnants mixed together in this area. I'm near an area that served as a rail terminus back in the day. The area was a big vacation spot for the rich city folk to get away from Manhattan. So there were clam and oyster bars (hence all the shells that show up in TOC dumps here), restaurants, hotels and horse drawn wagons taking people all over the place around this area. The bone is definitely bigger than the cow bones you show here. The molar *might* be a cow's although it is a lot longer than the one in your picture, but I really think the front tooth I found is from a horse.

 The bones are showing up in a dried creek bed that is starting to be the main conduit for water again, now that a very old sewer pipe that was laid in parallel with it is mostly clogged. In one spot, it cracked and created a sinkhole. We've had some torrential rain, so stuff is starting to come to light.

 Eileen


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## VTdigger (Jun 14, 2012)

> Report


 that's interesting to learn about the horses.
 the very first time I searched in the rivers by the Norton pottery site that was there from the 1830s to the early 1900's I found a horse or cow tooth I wish I could post a pic but it looks like that. I know they used horses at the pottery to deliver there ware and the stables where  across the street down river from where I found the tooth along with a few pottery shards, kiln stackers and such.  Of course there's no way of knowing where the tooth  actually came from, but the area where it was found, by an old pottery was for me a good find.


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## RICKJJ59W (Jun 14, 2012)

I found a whole horse in a big privy once. I am sure they chopped him up a bit ,but he was whole at one time.[8D]


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## AntiqueMeds (Jun 14, 2012)

> he was whole at one time


 
 were not all horse remains whole at one time?

 I was reading that after the American Revolution there wasnt really much of any government here in Frederick.
 THey said it was common for horses to die in the streets and lay rotting for weeks.
 People dumped chamber pots in the ditches along the streets.
 One of the first acts of the newly formed government was to require sanitary privies and a town dump/garbage collection.
 Government has its uses...


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## coreya (Jun 15, 2012)

Used to eat at a steak house in Miami in the 70's where you had to stand in line for hours to get in, They had the BEST  steaks I've ever eaten and I've eaten some fine steaks (ruth cris, stockyards etc). Turns out they were serving horse! I sure do miss that steak house and wilbur. [][][]


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## bostaurus (Jun 15, 2012)

In Europe, by law the butcher shops and food carts that sell horse meat and things made from horse meat must be separate from regular butcher shops.  The 'horse" shops are usually easy to tell...a metal horse head over the door or painted on the window.  The food vendors at the street markets are a bit harder.  It comes down to reading the signs well and being able to translate them.  I have many friends that have eaten horse brats without knowing...until they were told later.  I learned it is best to let them keep eating...some folks, when you tell them while they are still eating, tend to make a bit of a scene.  Others don't mind.


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## Dugout (Jun 15, 2012)

Unlike cows and hogs, horses sweat. And that is one reason for not eating them.


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