# G W Merchant questions



## stonebottle (Jan 5, 2009)

Hello all,

 The bottle on the right is a Lockport Blue bottle dug by my brother in Central NY state.  It was found under the rocks of a very old foundation.  It is embossed "From the Laboratory/of G W Merchant Chemist/Lockport N.Y."  The first picture shows this bottle with a different color Merchant he found about 10 miles away near another foundation.  Does this look like some kind of an iron pontil or other type pontil?  We have had trouble figuring it out because of the weird depression in the base.  There is no iron residue to be seen on the base.  The brown color on the base in the one photo is just a reflection.  So.. FIRST we are talking about the bottle on the right in the photo, SO LET'S CALL THE ONE ON THE RIGHT BOTTLE NUMBER 1 and the ONE ON THE LEFT BOTTLE NUMBER 2.  Note the period/dot after the word "Chemist" on bottle number 1.


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## stonebottle (Jan 5, 2009)

Here is a picture of the base ON BOTTLE NUMBER 1.


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## stonebottle (Jan 5, 2009)

Another picture of the base ON BOTTLE NUMBER 1.  The brown is just a reflection in this picture.


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## stonebottle (Jan 5, 2009)

Now this is a picture of what appears to be a repair to the mold ON BOTTLE NUMBER 1  Has anyone ever seen a G W Merchant bottle with this repair??  The other bottle, which was an emerald green sort of color, does not have the repair.  It would be great to know if this is a pontiled bottle and what everyone thinks of the mold repair.  I thought it was pretty amazing he found two different colors of Merchant bottles in the same town, but ten miles apart.  It would be great to know the value of these bottles, but I know he will never sell them.  These were very old homesteads on deserted back roads.  Thanks for your help.  stonebottle


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## woody (Jan 5, 2009)

I'd say the value is between $150-200 a piece.
 I don't think they are pontiled, though.
 I have seen pontiled versions of that bottle and it didn't look like that base.


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## div2roty (Jan 5, 2009)

I'm new to bottles, but that looks like a key mold base to me, which dates right after the pontil mark.  Here is a good page on bases http://www.sha.org/bottle/bases.htm#Snap%20Case%20&%20Sabot.  I hope that helps.


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## GuntherHess (Jan 5, 2009)

Very nice bottle. I have seen that mold a few times before.
 It is a diagnal hinge mold with a deep pushed up iron pontil. Yours doesnt seem to have any residue left in the mark. The mold repair is seen on those.
 Here is an old not so great photo from ebay of one of those but you can see the repair if you look close.


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## KentOhio (Jan 5, 2009)

I got a new digital camera for Christmas. Let's see if this works:


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## KentOhio (Jan 5, 2009)

Here's the base on mine, which must be a third mold variation.


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## RED Matthews (Jan 5, 2009)

To Stonebottle and Gutherhess:  First of all the seam is not located like a true key mold, because the diagonal is now lined up with the diagonal between the edge lines.  It was no doubt a bottom hinged mold but the location selection was to let the glass out of the mold when it was opened.
 The pontil is obviously from a specially made elongated oval punty rod.  With out residue identity, it was more than likely held with crushed glass on the heated punty rod.  It looks deep but it would take some high magnification to detect the holding media.
 Gunther:  Is the repair on the bottle you showed a long iron insert block on the right had side of the panel?  The must have had a letter cutting error on both bottle molds to require this type of mold cavity insert.  The squared opening in the mold being difficult to create.  
 This was an interesting post - thank you both.
 RED Matthews


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## RED Matthews (Jan 5, 2009)

To Kent Ohio:  Your bottle looks like a typical bottom hinged key mold with a center domed bottom post.  It is hard to see the mold lines, but they seem to be there going to the beveled edge diagonal corners.  
 These are all neat bottles.  The Lockport Glass House also made a lot of glass for the Saratoga M/W bottles.  I really liked the green one as it looks like their glass,  I especially liked the sloppy glass under the finish on that one.  Thanks - RED Matthews


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## GuntherHess (Jan 5, 2009)

The repair was a rivetted rectagle over the "LO" in lockport. You can see the rivet mark well in Stonebottle's photo. 
 I have never tried to do a study on all the mold variants of these but there are quite a few odd ones.


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## ktbi (Jan 5, 2009)

I saw this one up for auction this week and thought you might be interested.  Here's the link for the auctions:

http://www.americanbottle.com/?x=36&y=15

 Ron


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## kungfufighter (Jan 5, 2009)

Not pontiled as far as I can tell.  Have seen these bottles with iron and blowpipe pontils but this one sure appears to me to be smooth based...


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## kungfufighter (Jan 5, 2009)

See you are lurking Mike - do you think it's pontiled?  Looks just the smooth based ones we had way back when at the Knotty Pine Show


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## GuntherHess (Jan 5, 2009)

> Not pontiled as far as I can tell


 
 Which bottle are you referring to? There are a couple different ones in the thread...


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## woody (Jan 5, 2009)

I believe Jeff is talking about the 2nd and 3rd posts with the rectangular bases.


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## stonebottle (Jan 5, 2009)

I really appreciate all the comments.  First it sounded like BOTTLE NUMBER 1 was iron pontil, but now there is some controversy.  Interesting discussion, let's keep it going.  Here now is a few pictures of the bottle ON THE LEFT in the first picture, let's call it BOTTLE NUMBER 2.  It is emerald green and does not have the mold repair.  The base is different also.  Let's see what everyone thinks about this one.  stonebottle


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## stonebottle (Jan 5, 2009)

Antother bottom view of BOTTLE NUMBER 2.


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## stonebottle (Jan 5, 2009)

Lip view of BOTTLE NUMBER 2.


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## kungfufighter (Jan 5, 2009)

I don't see evidence of a pontil mark in either of stonebottle's Merchants or KentOhio's bottle...


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## stonebottle (Jan 5, 2009)

If both bottles are not pontiled, what is the reason for the deep rectangular depression on the bottoms?  Bottle number 1 (Lockport blue) has the deepest space on the bottom.  Is this some kind of a space in the mold or a vent area??  I am getting the impression these bottles are kind of hard to figure out.  Thanks again everyone, for all your input.  stonebottle


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## Staunton Dan (Jan 5, 2009)

Thought that I would throw this one in the mix. This is a true open pontiled version that I sold on ebay just before Christmas for a little over $200. It does not have the mold repair.


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## RED Matthews (Jan 5, 2009)

> < Message edited by Staunton Dan -- 1/5/2009 4:29:02 PM >


  Hello,  Yours is a neat bottle also.  It has the line of a key type mold but the circle also looks like it was empontilled with a disc type punty rod with crushed glass on the edge.  Can you elaborate on what it looks like to you.  Thanks  RED Matthews


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## kungfufighter (Jan 5, 2009)

For what it's worth I've never seen Staunton Dan's bottle with any other type of pontil scar...


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## woody (Jan 5, 2009)

I remember digging a cylindrical G.W. Merchants with an iron pontil once.
 There was plenty of iron left on the base of the bottle.
 It was a round iron pontil, though.


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## Staunton Dan (Jan 5, 2009)

> ORIGINAL: RED Matthews
> 
> Hello,  Yours is a neat bottle also.  It has the line of a key type mold but the circle also looks like it was empontilled with a disc type punty rod with crushed glass on the edge.  Can you elaborate on what it looks like to you.  Thanks  RED Matthews


 
 I don't have enough experience with pontiled bottles to elaborate any more than I have. What you said sounds good to me.


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## GuntherHess (Jan 5, 2009)

The only IP types I have seen are the type I posted the photo for and the cylinders.
 All the others were smooth based or tubular open pontil marks.


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## div2roty (Jan 5, 2009)

Either way, I think they are pretty.................unless they are "boy" bottles, than they might be handsome.


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## appliedlips (Jan 5, 2009)

I don't know which is which but I don't see any iron pontil marks in this thread.Still a great bottle and probably just as old as most of the pontilled examples.


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## kungfufighter (Jan 5, 2009)

Agreed Doug - my sense is that the iron pontiled cylinders in particular are actually quite late, perhaps even later than some of the smooth based "From the Laboratory of" bottles...


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## Dabeel (Jan 6, 2009)

The G.W Merchant I found in Sacramento was easy to id the iron pontil as shown below,
 those rectangular ones have interesting depressions on them though.

 good finds especially with the different shade of color.

 Doug


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## Dabeel (Jan 6, 2009)

here's the front view

 I recommend not selling them as they are too nice of a bottle to part with...the G.W Merchant's have a lot of character.


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## stonebottle (Jan 6, 2009)

I really like the round version of the G W Merchant also.  I guess we have come to the conclusion that the two rectangular bottles I posted are not iron pontiled.  The bases on them really are weird and interesting, especially with the different types that have been shown.  My brother found these two, now I am hoping it is my turn.  Thanks again everyone for your input.  stonebottle


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## GuntherHess (Jan 6, 2009)

Without iron residue I would go with the experts and call it smooth base.
 That first one does have an odd base. That mold is found with iron pontil marks as I have seen at least two examples with the iron residue remaining..


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## kungfufighter (Jan 6, 2009)

That's been my experience as well...


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