# Real arrowhead???



## towhead (Jun 18, 2010)

Got a bunch of bottles and a can of agates from a sale....Bottles are all common stuff....However, this arrowhead was in the can of agates...do you think it is "NEW" ?  Thank you! -Julie


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## pyshodoodle (Jun 18, 2010)

I know very little about arrowheads, so I'm going to see what the experts say, but I will say I never saw an arrowhead with so little "working" on it. 
 You're thinking the same thing?


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## RED Matthews (Jun 18, 2010)

Hi,  I doubt that it is new.  Why would anyone make them today?   Maybe if the thought they could sell them.  In my opinion they won't get rich doing that.  RED M.


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## pyshodoodle (Jun 19, 2010)

I'm going with new. (In fact, there's one in this pic that looks extremely similar)
 http://www.paulssupplies.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=8&products_id=199

 Arrowheads and spear points should have ridges on the sides (to help kill stuff). It doesn't look very functional.


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## GuntherHess (Jun 19, 2010)

looks like a tourist item to me.


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## LC (Jun 19, 2010)

There is a lot of people today chipping out arrowheads Red and trying to pass them off as authentic to make money on them , or at least there are in my area . The one pictured to me has so little working that I would say it is not an old one , but then too , that is just my opinion , I could be wrong though .  

 There was a guy here local here some years back came up with a set of six of the most beautifully chipped out spears a person ever seen . Only thing was , they were chipped out of different colored pieces of glass . The person who chipped them out was sure good at doing it .


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## pyshodoodle (Jun 19, 2010)

There's a flintknapper in my area that will teach you if you want... You can just go to his house Tuesday nights or something. (It's been about 5 years since I saw him- don't know if he still does that.)
 I've watched him make them and he does a great job. He said experts can tell who created the arrowheads... in other words, it's actually possible to track some of the Indian trading by arrowheads and where they end up. Not all Indians kapped their own points. It was a skill that only a few were masters of. 

 They used deer antlers to knap the stones, but modern knappers use these sticks with copper on the ends.


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## LC (Jun 19, 2010)

That's interesting , I do not know any of them who do it around here , but there are some who really have the knack to do so .


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## pyshodoodle (Jun 19, 2010)

Also, modern flintknappers with integrity sign their work and do not try to pass them off as ancient relics.


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## LC (Jun 19, 2010)

Regretfully , there are many that don't . Money does strange things to some people . I used to know a guy that would take the reproduction fruit jars and scratch them up on concrete to try and get them to look old . I hate to admit it but he managed to screw me over with one of them on one occasion , never dealt with him again after that .


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## CALDIGR2 (Jun 19, 2010)

Sorry, but that's just junk knocked out to sell to unknowing folks. Real arrow points look like this.


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## LC (Jun 19, 2010)

That is indeed a real beauty . I have a few points put away somewhere around here , but none of them are what you can call beauties , they are authentic though .


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## Poison_Us (Jun 19, 2010)

It's new.  It lacks the finished quality of a true artifact.  Now, there are professional knappers out there that can make one's as good and better than historical points, but they make their points from good obsidian and like minerals.  But there are also mass produced ones that are for tourists made out of the Philippines and other places.  This is one of those.


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## pyshodoodle (Jun 19, 2010)

> ORIGINAL: CALDIGR2
> 
> Sorry, but that's just junk knocked out to sell to unknowing folks. Real arrow points look like this.
> 
> ...


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## RED Matthews (Jun 19, 2010)

So it is nothing new,  I haven't kept up my study of arrowheads though the battle of Redl Jacket and Sullivans Army took place about 1/4 mile from my NY home and my Grandfather lived next to it and collected a hundred or so arrow heads while working in his vineyard.  I never did know who ended up with his arrow heads - it wasn't me.
 RED Matthews


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## LC (Jun 19, 2010)

I know individuals in my area who possess fairly large collections of beautiful points found through out my area where I live . Some of them have collected as long thirty years or so . Today there is so much no till farming where I live that hunting Indian artifacts has dropped off tremendously .


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## sloughduck (Jun 19, 2010)

This looks like a new knapped point.


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## pyshodoodle (Jun 20, 2010)

OK, so I visited my dad today and since this post was fresh in my mind, I took some pictures of my mom's bowl of goodies. These were given to her by Eva Yohe, who died in 1986. I think she was 91 when she died. I think most of these were found by her husband Russell, when he worked in the fields when he was young. Their farm is near where a lot of arrowheads used to be found. So - these points were actually FOUND around 100 years ago... maybe more, as I don't know if all these were actually found by Russell, or if they just were all in the family & he ended up with them. I do know that Russell was not a farmer. He became a school teacher, as did Eva.


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## pyshodoodle (Jun 20, 2010)

*


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## pyshodoodle (Jun 20, 2010)

THe flip side of the red one pointing down still has a lot of dirt on it. I will be washing it on a future visit.


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## pyshodoodle (Jun 20, 2010)

One more


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## pyshodoodle (Jun 20, 2010)

by the way, cuz someone is going to ask, the broken stoneware in the bowl I think was dug by me behind the mill. (Or it could be some other broken stuff they found, but I think that's where it's from - and haven't found any whole stuff out there yet.)


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## Wangan (Jun 21, 2010)

Very nice points Kate! Ive only found one. Our area was covered in miles of ice,so nothing up here older than 10,000 years from what Ive been told.That sounds old,but not in terms of points,spearheads and etc.


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## GuntherHess (Jun 21, 2010)

10,000 years BP would be considered very early for human artifacts in North America.
 http://www.museum.state.il.us/ismdepts/anthro/proj_point/points_timeline.html


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## Wangan (Jun 21, 2010)

Especially as the glaciers receded from Illinois before they did in Maine.


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## GuntherHess (Jun 21, 2010)

Most artifacts are going to be newer than 10,000 Yrs BP no matter where you find them in North America.


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## pyshodoodle (Jun 21, 2010)

http://explorepahistory.com/hmarker.php?markerId=734

 Short article to back you up, Matt. 

 In happen to be located in Jasper Central.[]


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## towhead (Jun 21, 2010)

Thank you pyshodoo, LC, Red, Matt, caldigr2, poisons us, sloughduck and wangan for your replies and info!  It is gr8tly appreciated!!  -Julie


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## GuntherHess (Jun 21, 2010)

> http://explorepahistory.com/hmarker.php?markerId=734


 
 Thats interesting, thier reference was written by Henry C Mercer. That guy really was prolific.  Has anyone been to his amazing American history museum near Philly? (hint , dont go in the winter, it wasnt heated last time I was there).
 He wrote a book on 18th century German decorated cast iron firebacks that I used to research one in my house.


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## OsiaBoyce (Jun 21, 2010)

> ORIGINAL: GuntherHess
> 
> Most artifacts are going to be newer than 10,000 Yrs BP no matter where you find them in North America.


 
 Then again.......

http://www.athenapub.com/topper.htm


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## GuntherHess (Jun 21, 2010)

interesting, but I'll stick by my statement that artifacts you find will probably be later than 10,000Yrs BP.


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## woodswalker (Jun 24, 2010)

Here's mine...found it in the woods behind my house...first one ever and I was amazed at how sharp they are!!!!
    Manda~


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## GuntherHess (Jun 24, 2010)

wow nice serrated point


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## Staunton Dan (Jun 24, 2010)

> ORIGINAL:  GuntherHess
> 
> 10,000 years BP would be considered very early for human artifacts in North America.
> http://www.museum.state.il.us/ismdepts/anthro/proj_point/points_timeline.html


 
 Matt, I thought that you originally made a mistake when you wrote BP but when you used it again I wasn't sure. What does BP stand for - Before Pocahontas?


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## GuntherHess (Jun 24, 2010)

before present.


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## Staunton Dan (Jun 24, 2010)

Never saw that before. Makes more sense to do it that way rather than BC where you have to add 2000 years.


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## pyshodoodle (Jun 24, 2010)

[sm=lol.gif] I like Before Pocahantas, better! Pretty much the same difference, ayway when you're talking 10,000 years.


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## Staunton Dan (Jun 24, 2010)

Me too Kate, it has a certain je ne se qua. Here is what Wikipedia says about Pocahontas. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pocahontas  I didn't know that she only lived to be 22 or so.


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## GuntherHess (Jun 24, 2010)

BC is a non-scientific date reference.


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## Staunton Dan (Jun 24, 2010)

Again, I'm not sure what BC means, possibly Before Cleopatra. Might not be scientific, but the archies seem to use it a lot, but then again I never did trust archies.


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## Staunton Dan (Jun 24, 2010)

Speaking of Cleopatra, here's some info on her. http://ancienthistory.about.com/od/cleopatra/a/CleopatraGuide_3.htm Looks like she lived a bit longer. There's that BC word again.


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## RedGinger (Jun 24, 2010)

I thought it meant Before Christ, but they changed it for PC purposes.  Joe says I am too literal, so maybe you guys already know and I am not in on the joke.  Cool arrowhead, Woodswalker.  I would love to find some where I live.  The Senecas have a reservation nearby and a lot of them do not like us.  That's cool to find it right behind your house.  I'd be out looking for more!


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## RedGinger (Jun 24, 2010)

> ORIGINAL: GuntherHess
> 
> BC is a non-scientific date reference.


 
 Okay, I should have read this before I posted.  BTW, nice arrowheads, Kate.


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## pyshodoodle (Jun 24, 2010)

Wasn't Jesus actually born around 4 BC? (And you all thought Immaculate Conception was special![8|])


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## Staunton Dan (Jun 24, 2010)

> ORIGINAL:  pyshodoodle
> 
> Wasn't Jesus actually bornÂ around 4 BC? (And you all thought Immaculate Conception was special![8|])


 
 So Christ was born before Christ. Does that make sense? Makes you just want to go hmmmmmmmm!


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## GuntherHess (Jun 25, 2010)

THere is aparently no definate date when Joshua bar Joseph (Jesus in Greek) was born. There are different sources for dates but they conflict.


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## pyshodoodle (Jun 25, 2010)

Yes - I think it's now believed to be somewhere between 4BC & 6BC... My comment did make you smile, though, right Matt?


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## Wangan (Jun 25, 2010)

What in the wide world of sports is a-goin on here!!!???[]


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## woodswalker (Jun 25, 2010)

Never talk Politics or religion....no matter what no one is ever right, every one has their own beliefs.....but sometimes people do get carried away with such silly things....Like taking Christ out of Christmas.....or a near by school had a pic of jesus hanging on the wall for 50 some years...now its all of a sudden a problem and had to be taken down....
     If you don't like it don't look at it and if you don;t want to hear what some one else has got to say....keep your mouth shut!![8D] 
  Besides I thought we were talking arrowheads here?[8|]


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## pyshodoodle (Jun 25, 2010)

Hmmm.... I was talking historical theory...[] I try to keep myself out of the religious/political debates that go on here!  Don't need the stress![8|]


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## GuntherHess (Jun 25, 2010)

I dont believe in any of the multitudes of worldly religions so I wont take offense at anything you say about any of them. Maybe someday I will be converted , then watch out[]


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## woodswalker (Jun 25, 2010)

Were in the same boat...I could care less I just always seem to walk into to these discussions and pretend I'm not listening!!!!![]
   I'm more of a spiritual person.....The whole sun moon and stars stuff is my thing......


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## woodswalker (Jun 25, 2010)

Opps sorry Kate...I missed that part I guess...I do like the pocahontas theory tho....BP   that can stand for lots a things now days.....first bell ringer is OIL SPILL!!!![]


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## pyshodoodle (Jun 25, 2010)

I'm an energy person, myself. People get too worked up about religion... now, politics - I can get worked up about. Choose not to, especially here.


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## woodswalker (Jun 25, 2010)

No kidding!!! I get irritated just seeing it on the news!!!  My energy is being bottled right now...my car broke down and I'm raring to get out of here fix it and get on to doing something else!!! Fridays drag!! Luckily it broke down right in my co workers drive way...I'm hoping its outta gas...the gauge went crazy on me...thought had at least a half a tank....


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## pyshodoodle (Jun 25, 2010)

Here's to hoping for an easy fix for your car!


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## woodswalker (Jun 25, 2010)

My fingers are crossed!!!!![]


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## daltonbottles (Jul 10, 2010)

Aaaaah, another one of my collecting passions.  Lots of worn out tennis shoes to find this stuff over the years.


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## daltonbottles (Jul 10, 2010)

A few others from Spiro Mounds, OK.


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## daltonbottles (Jul 10, 2010)

and.......


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## daltonbottles (Jul 10, 2010)

Quartz Crystal Hayes Point from the Tommy Goff collection.


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## daltonbottles (Jul 11, 2010)

Other misc. Indian stuff from Eastern Oklahoma.......


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## glass man (Jul 12, 2010)

> ORIGINAL:  RED Matthews
> 
> Hi,Â  I doubt that it is new.Â  Why would anyone make them today? Â  Maybe if the thought they could sell them.Â  In my opinion they won't get rich doing that.Â  RED M.


 

 RED: I KNOW A MAN THAT CAN AND DOES MAKE THEM JUST LIKE THE INDIANS DID AROUND HERE WITH FLINT...HE IS GREAT AT IT..I WATCHED HIM AS HE DID IT..YOU ARE RIGHT HE WON'T GET RICH FROM IT,BUT HAS MADE SOME MONEY AT ARTS AND CRAFT SHOWS!

 AFTER SEEING WHAT HE COULD DO..I WOULD HAVE TO FIND THE ARROW HEAD IN THE FIELD TO KNOW IT IS OLD OR KNOW AND TRUST THE PERSON I GOT IT FROM TO KNOW IF ORIGINAL OR NOT! JAMIE


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## glass man (Jul 12, 2010)

WHEN WAS JESUS BORN? I DON'T KNOW I WEREN'T THERE,BUT HEY HE STILL LIVES! JAMIE


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