# ebay hidden bidders



## mrbottles (Feb 28, 2007)

Hey folks,

 What does everyone think about ebay not showing the bidders user name?  I was run up by shill bidders once in the past.  Ebay pulled the user off the site for a period of time.  It seems to me that the primary benefit would be to people who want to run up their own auctions.  

 Steven


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## capsoda (Feb 28, 2007)

Hey Dude, I think it is crap. The only reason I can think of for hiding you ID is because they are up to no good.



 Hows Mom and the little one?


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## mrbottles (Feb 28, 2007)

Hey Warren Eli and mom are excellent!  Thanks for asking.  He is in the 90th percentile for height 50th for weight and 95th for head circumference at nine months and has a happy personality!  

 I just wonder why ebay did this.  They know shill bidding is bunk.  They say they want to stomp it out BUT they take a cut and now who is to know.


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## whiskeyman (Feb 28, 2007)

I tend to agree, but FeeBay pretty much does what it likes...and one can but go with the situation. Supposedly this was to "protect" the winning bidder from follow-up offers,etc...but - eBay lets the seller make a 2nd chance offer....thus putting someone else with a similar item outta luck as far as contacting a prospective buyer.
 There are still yet many shill bidders and sellers who have "friends" who run up items. It sure makes you wonder when you see a bidder who hasn't gotten any FB in months  or with zero FB, suddenly bidding on the same thing you are.
 I ran a test once...bought an electric bitters at close to $35. It started at $9.99 and I was quickly ran up.
 I waited a while and relisted it at $9.99...no bids. I relisted it twice more at $9.99 over a period of several months...and still no bids. I ended up giving it to a friend.


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## mrbottles (Feb 28, 2007)

Hi whiskeyman,

 That is exactly right.  I think every bottle collector that buys on ebay has had the feeling that an auction has been run up in that exact same way.  I just donâ€™t get it.  I canâ€™t see why ebay went this rout.  Is there anywhere else you can list a bottle for auction like that? I remember the first time I found ebay.  I was late into the game but I thought it was a miracle.  It still is incredible but are there any other options?

 Steven


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## epgorge (Feb 28, 2007)

[quote]He is in the 90th percentile for height 50th for weight and 95th for head circumference at nine months and has a happy personality! [/quote]

Hey proud Dad,
You oughta get a bumper sticker made with that on it.[]
Joel


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## bearswede (Mar 1, 2007)

I personally hate it... Sometimes I see a bottle that I think someone should/might be bidding on and I would like to see if they are in the frey... But let's face it... When's the last time you knew who you were bidding against at Glassworks, or BAM, or Heckler's??

  Still, that's what used to set ebay apart... Now I feel like I'm "blinded by the scheit"...


  Ron


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## baltbottles (Mar 1, 2007)

I have to agree with Ron I liked to know who I was bidding against. You could tell if you were competing with a big spender on a lot and decide how high you needed to go to have a chance to get the item. Plus I just liked knowing who was winning what.

 Chris


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## Humabdos (Mar 1, 2007)

I don't like it eather. I think we should all send a complaint to E-bay.


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## stinger haut (Mar 1, 2007)

My wife and I don't like or quite understand why ebay is hiding buyers I.D.s in some auctions and not in others. I buy wooden fishing lures and they haven't hidden anyone's I.D. with those auctions.
 My wife does buy and sell bottles on ebay (not a lot) but enough to have been in an auction where they are hiding the other buyers I.D.s. She buys a lot of quilts and they haven't done that either with those auctions.
 My wife called their toll free number and asked about this hiding buyers I.D. s. She was told by the customer service person that it is up to the buyer if they want to hide there I.D. in an auction.  She asked why would a buyer want to do that? They answered because a buyer may not want others to know that they had bought on ebay because they might want to resell it again on ebay and personal privacy.
 Those seemed like a real reasons, but it can't be the whole truth in our opinion. She is going to call them today and see what another customer rep tells her why they are doing this.
 Stinger Haut


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## epgorge (Mar 1, 2007)

complaining to Ebay is like peeing your pants in a dark suit. It will initially give you a good warm feeling and no one will notice.

 I have decided to limit the amount of my transactions with Ebay. I have cut them back considerably over the past three months. That is the only way to get their attention, through their stockholders. There are other places to buy, and sell. 

 Joel


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## stinger haut (Mar 1, 2007)

O.K. My wife just got off the phone with ebay's customer service. She got a different customer sales rep and a somewhat different answer about hidden I.D.s.
 This guy mentioned the privacy issue but added about protecting the sellers and buyers from other members and outside scammers trying to run a scam on them. She asked about the resell thing and he replied that wasn't an issue.
 We think its a bunch of lies. It seems to us that ebay is trying to have more control over the interaction of its users.  What epgorge stated in an earlier post is a very good way of what its like to try and talk to ebay.
 Stinger Haut


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## mrbottles (Mar 1, 2007)

To me it just FEELS like it is a profit thing.  I tried to look at the opinion forum on ebay to see what other users are saying about it.  I left without finding what i was looking for.  In the last few years ebay has become a mess.  Who wants to deal with all of the crap?  They have such a mess of information that finding what you want is an exercise in futility.  Moving away from openness and transparency just invites fraud.  Why wouldn't ebay want shill bidding to go unnoticed?  If no one can see what is happening they have less administrative work AND more income.

 Wouldn't it be nice to have a site like ebey used to be without all of the junk for just bottles?


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## CALDIGR2 (Mar 2, 2007)

I will not bid on any auction that hides a bidders screen name. I especially am turned off by the weak sisters that use "bidder#s". That amounts to nothin' more than shill bidding at it's worst.[]


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## capsoda (Mar 2, 2007)

It all sounds very strange. either you are open and above board or if they are going to hid a bidders ID then they should hide ALL bidders IDs. Only the sell would know who was bidding.


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## GuntherHess (Mar 2, 2007)

Here is ebays reason

 As the internet evolves, eBay continues to strike a balance between preserving transparency and protecting our Community of members. eBay has decided to change how bid history information is displayed so bad guys cannot target bidders with fake offers using this information. In certain cases, some bidders will no longer be able to view Bidder User IDs on the Bid History page. Your User ID will be shown only to you and the seller of the item you're bidding on. Other members will see an anonymous name, such as Bidder 1, applied consistently to the Bid History page.

 ...I understand thier reasoning but the fix seems to cause as many problems as it solves


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## mrbottles (Mar 3, 2007)

Hi Matt,

 If it was an attempt to keep people from taking advantage of other ebay users how misguided is it?  The biggest problem antique bottle collectorâ€™s face is shills.  It is the one kind of fraud that we can all be subjected to if there is not protection.  You can educate yourself against fakes.  People used to be able to watch out for each other now where are we.  As I said before I once caught a shill bidder.  It was red handed.  No matter what the main user sold the same two under bidders ran the auction up.  The user admitted it and said it started as setting a reserve and then just got out of control.  That resulted in a few month suspension from ebay.  The only way I was able to see it is gone.  Second when I first started collecting I bid on a yellow Milwaukee medicine with a paper label.  A big dog collector emailed me and said it is a known fake.  Turns out the winner again seemed to bid on just about anything the seller put up winning many but not leaving feedback.  Now beginners are hanging in the wind.  I don't see any positive to this other than making more money as shills figure it out and start to run rampant. 

 A few other big dog bottle folks are not going to buy or sell on ebay for the next month.  Boycotts don't work BUT maybe it is time to find a better way to buy and sell antique bottles and advertising as a community.

 Steven


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## epgorge (Mar 3, 2007)

> our dislike of hiding bidders ids.


 [&:]

 I will be out back splitting infinitives.

 Joel


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## epgorge (Mar 3, 2007)

One may take a diplomatic approach if one wants! I believe hitting them in the pocketbook. 

 Here is my letter to them.

 Joel

 To Whom It May Concern,

 I wish to cancel my Ebay account immediately. I am concerned about Ebays policy of allowing bidders to go un-noticed. 

 A quick search of my purchases over the past two years will indicate a heavy buying pattern for antique bottles, as I am a collector. 

 Ebays shift in policy of not allowing me to see who is bidding against me only encourages shill bidding. Ebay only stands to gain by allowing potential â€œshillersâ€ to go unmonitored.

 I have no other choice but to seek other auction facilities to accommodate my past time. 

 Thank you for your immediate attention to this matter.

 Joel Williams
 Mistyriverseve


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## epgorge (Mar 3, 2007)

We as bidders not only spend much money on ebay products, but we also inflate the bidding process. 

 It is as with any "burst growth business". On the rise of the bell curve, they don't really care about qualitative management, just quanititative management. 

 Just as with AOL, they will change their practices when they realize their quality, or lack thereof, is causing their bell curve to turn downward. That is when stockholders complain and quantity is replaced with quality.

 Just a voice in the wind? Perhaps!

 Joel


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## GuntherHess (Mar 3, 2007)

I dont like ebay hiding the bidder name but its not likely we can do much about it. They have made changes in the past that greatly upset thier users and they have never seemed too concerned about it since they are really a monopoly when it comes to general online auctions. There are several other auction sites just for bottles but if you take note most of them dont show you any bidder info other than the last bid price.


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## epgorge (Mar 3, 2007)

I guess I just get personal satisfaction and a huge monthly savings. You all get one less enthusiast bidding against you. 
 It sounds like a win win to me.


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## poisons4me (Mar 3, 2007)

ebay has been out of control for a while,i been on there since 1999 as reg user.i have been sent broken,damaged and totally misdescribed stuff and then threatened with neg feedback.people dont pay or pay slow...then threaten neg if you dont ship in 1 day.I dont think your not using them will even catch their eye,we are small change to them now,they have china and are so money hungry at this point i dont think they feel anyone can touch them............stupid thinking,google is in process of making auction site,they can hurt ebay and have the cash and drive to stay for the long fight,im waiting for them.Ebay with the last round of hikes ect lost alot of the powersellers and store owners.......no care.policy stayed.i dont agree with comparing the heckler,glassworks to ebay as far as not seeing bidders,the people who run these 2 auction houses i know and are also huge collectors and watch things very close.just my opinion folks.


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## mrbottles (Mar 3, 2007)

Hey poison4me,

 I have heard good things about the people who run the auction houses you listâ€¦  Great reputations and years of collecting.  Still in comparison to how ebay does an auction they are not even in the running for easy access user friendly and open/transparent process.  Consider ebay is going down the sewer and they still are simpler and make more sense for the average user.  We need a better choice.  

 While ebay canâ€™t stop people from lying and being unscrupulous it used to seem like bottle people had a niche on eby and it doesnâ€™t anymore.  Nobody cared we were there and we went about our hobby with only minimal intrusion in the process.  Ebay was a great tool when it helped build a connection in the collecting community (or at least stayed out of the way) and we were able to find what we were looking for quickly, communicate with each other and everyone was fine.  Now there is so much garbage on ebay that no matter what you search for you have to weed through the junk.  Search for what you collect and you get pills, wine, hydroponics growing systems, trailers and a bunch of other garbage.  Then the darkened windows set it.  We canâ€™t see even feedback now.  Writing a letter will do what?  I am serious about another solution.  I am going to contact the bottle specific on line auctioneers and see what they think.  I use Google to search I like google.  The Google solution will be an even greater vortex sucking the fun out of collecting.  We need a bottle specific solution.  Ebay in ten years will be an on line dollar store the way it is going.  

 Steven


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## logueb (Mar 3, 2007)

I have never bought or sold on Ebay.  But I have done a lot of buying various merchadise at live auctions. A lot of these auctions have what I call "ringers" who drive up the bids. If they get stuck with the merchadise, you can bet that down the road this item will sell again.  They also prey on new or inexperienced bidders. Sometimes even the auctioneer is even bidding himself.  So he's bidding on his own stuff sometimes. Apparently Ebay is allowing this same thing to happen. I like to know who I am bidding against and don't like to feel that I have been jacked-up just for the sake of someone trying to make few extra bucks off me.


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## epgorge (Mar 4, 2007)

Not only that, but how many times have you sat there and watched your bid stop at $5 bucks when you know there is more reserve there, just no one bidding on it. The thought may enter your mind to callyour freind or relative, but we don't do it, or at least I do't do it. I have thought of it, but didn't do it.

 I went ot Yahoo last night and shpped around. They just don't have the product or the buyers there, yet.


 ebay won't cancel me for at least 180 days so .... oh well i am in selling mode now anyway, not buyng.

 Joel


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## poisons4me (Mar 4, 2007)

I agree with opening doors for collectors they helped improve my collection and changed the price and known availabilty of some bottles but,one should never forget in business who put you there.......fees dont hit the buy a few here and there like they do the power sellers and people with 4 and 5 digit feedback.(i am not one!) and got there in a few years.That times all those people is huge.I end with that,only my opinion but we can use the web space here to talk about good stuff!!!


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## mrbottles (Mar 4, 2007)

Hi Rick, discussing improving the process for antique bottle collectors is pretty positive to me.  You have to hear what is being done wrong to figure out a better way.  I am going to figure out if a bottle specific inexpensive auction site is a possibility.  I looked at your site and followed the link through to your recommended bottle auction site.  I believe they are using some third party software.  I tried to search for Wisconsin in the auction that you linked into.  Unfortunately there was nothing but I did get that notice of a 12% buyers premium for anything I purchase.   I like your site because it is just sharing of information.  The few things you are selling look like reasonably good deals.  Any idea where I can get one of those bottle molds?  That is very cool!


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## epgorge (Mar 4, 2007)

"we were able to find what we were looking for quickly, communicate with each other and everyone was fine"

 Another reason we aren't finding the deals and the bidding is through the roof is that Bottle collecting is the third fastest growing hobby in America.

 Ep


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## mrbottles (Mar 4, 2007)

Hi Wil,

 For people who donâ€™t know Wil he is one of the big dogs nationally.  His website is http://www.bottleden.com.  It is one of the best resources on the web for pontiled American soda bottles.  

 Wil I think this is going to hurt ebay bad.  Maybe not immediately but everyone I talk to in Wisconsin is viscerally angered by this.  That has to amount to something.

 Steven


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## capsoda (Mar 5, 2007)

Hey Steven, Thanks for posting Wil's site.

 Hey Wil, Welcome to the forum. Great site. I enjoy browsing everyones sites wheather I collect the type of bottles on them or not. Always something new to learn.


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## epgorge (Mar 5, 2007)

Rick, 

 Nice poisons!!!!

 Like the blues in the background. Stars too... they gave me one of those free ones they promised me back in the Sixties, though. 

 Joel


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## GuntherHess (Mar 5, 2007)

As sellers there IS something we can do about the hidden ID situation if we want to. If ebay makes my auction a hidden bidder auction I will just append the actual bidder names to the auction... like BIDDER1 = GUNTHERHESS.  Easy to do... no more hidden auction. The seller can always see the bidders.


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## bearswede (Mar 5, 2007)

I think I've discovered how ebay is running this hidden bidder thing... I won an auction last nite that was running at around $87... I knew it was a good bottle that not everyone knew much about so I put a large snipe bid on it... All the bidders were revealed until the last few seconds when the price went over $200... At which time the auction ended and the bidders' names except the winner were masked...


  Ron


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## GuntherHess (Mar 5, 2007)

The threshold does seem to be about $200 from what I can see.  
 So that means I wont have to be posting bidder names on too many of my bottle auctions.[]


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## baltbottles (Mar 6, 2007)

Ok I have spent a few days looking into the logistics of setting up an ebay format auction site. Just for antique bottles and related collectables such as insulators, marbles, and stoneware. All things that we dig and find. What i've found is that it would be possabile to set up such a site. However it will probably require around a $10,000 investment to get the site started. And cover bandwith and hosting costs for the first 6 months. Now the question is would the bottle collecting community support this type of site? And How much to charge to sell. I think i could offer free to list your bottles and free picture hosting and very low fee reserves I was thinking of charging a flat $2 for a reserve listing and then a flat 3-5 percent final value fee the final value fee will have to be a bit higher then ebays to offer the listings with no listing fees. So it only would cost you anything if your bottle actually dose sell or if you put a reserve price on your auction. But for this too work i'd need you as collectors to list large amounts of bottles on the site and to buy alot of stuff to get the ball rolling. So what dose everyone think?

 Chris


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## annie44 (Mar 6, 2007)

Chris,
 I think it is a great idea, and I would try to support the site as much as possible.  I like that there would be no fee if a bottle doesn't sell.  It would also be nice if ones that don't sell can stay up on the site longer, because the short amount of time on ebay often doesn't result in a sale of items that are more commonly found.
 Keep us posted!
 Cindy


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## epgorge (Mar 6, 2007)

Not only would I support such a site but, please, allow me to be one of the first to buy stock in it.
 Joel


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## capsoda (Mar 6, 2007)

Great idea Chris. Stock options might not be a bad idea either.


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## Jim (Mar 6, 2007)

Chris, I would support your site, 110%. Since many of us here have our own websites, we could do a lot of free advertising for it to help get the ball rolling.

 I have bought and sold some great bottles as a member of eBay. However, I concur with the opinion that eBay's administration seems to care less and less about people like us. Some of their policies have, in my opinion, gone too far. Even as eBay continues to piss me off, until there is a viable alternative, I will just have to live with them.

 If we can make this happen for bottle diggers and collectors, I am sure that I will be one of hundreds and eventually maybe thousands who will happily kiss eBay goodbye forever! Let me know if there is anything I can do to help with this idea. ~Jim


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## mrbottles (Mar 6, 2007)

Hi Chris,

 I have a developer on it right now.  Not started with development, we are working out logistics.  I'm not sure how you came up with 10G.  If it was that easy it would have been done fifty times already. Your estimated cost might be a little short.  Looking at image host, secure credit card transactions LIVE auctions and software the site will cost a bit more to do anything like people will expect.  It has to be great or it will fail like a lot of half baked sites have.  I am guessing the first level of servers and software will be more than $10,000.  Bandwidth might be exorbitant too.  Development will be in the 100's of hours minimally.  $10,000 is $10 per hour for 100 hours.  I run a web company.  I donâ€™t know anyone who could do this that will work for $10 per hour.  

 Not to discourage just to inform.  

 If you are serious about doing this contact me.  

 Steven


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## Stoney (Mar 6, 2007)

Not to give eBay any credit , but I know of two people who were shut down for having someone with a different account, who was a family member, bid up an item...   One got back on, but not until 3 months passed...   She was told that if it happened again, she would be permenantly banned...   FWIW


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## baltbottles (Mar 6, 2007)

HI Steven,

   I guess I'm looking at a more minimalist's approach. Theres already off the shelf software that can do the ebay format type listings. I did a google search and found several companies that sold a product that could possibly work. But you have to look at what ebay was 8-9 years ago before paypal before live auctions before all the extra bell and whistles that no one really needs. thats what to me it seems everyone wants back. That ebay was far simpler. Also your looking at a limited market I mean how many bottle collectors are there online I'd bet its no more the 5000 thats nothing compared to the number of users on ebay at any given time. and how many auctions a month would you be dealing with well ebay had about 40,000 antique bottle and insulator auctions last month. But look at the percentage that were just put on by non bottle collectors I'm sure the actual number of auctions put on by bottle collectors is about half of that or less so 20,000 auctions per month. Now no site is going to start with 20k auctions listed the first day or month or several months. If you could get 1000 auctions a month with in 6 months I'd consider the site a success thats about 2.5 percent of ebays market share for antique bottles by auction volume. And I think at best you would only end up with about 5000-10000 auctions a month. because your not going to capture the listings from those who primarily deal in other things. or the average person that found some bottles they think mite be worth putting on ebay but who are not collectors. at max i think your looking at 25 percent of the market share by volume of auctions. however 80 percent of the higher priced bottles sold on ebay are by collectors to collectors. so your 25 percent of the auction volume should account for around 50 percent or more of the total final value of the auctions currently run on ebay every month. I believe being a collector specific site the quality of the items listed will be higher also resulting in a larger number of successfully completed auctions where the item sells. So my opinion is a smaller scale approach will end up being much more profitable then jumping in the deep end so to speak and trying to capture ebays market share all at once. Let me know what your opinion is?

   Chris


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## Trying not to break it (Mar 6, 2007)

hi chris,  i would suport it.   rhona


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## Jim (Mar 6, 2007)

Chris, I think you have an excellent (and realistic) approach to this. Once the site was up and running, and a few nice, high-quality bottles were successfully sold, I don't think it would take long for the word to spread. 

 A site like this would combine the advantages of eBay with some of the advantages of the big glass auction houses. It would also eliminate a lot of the unfavorable aspects of both (foolish eBay policies and high auction house commissions are two big ones). While nothing can please everyone 100% of the time, I do strongly believe that this idea would be a win/win situation for bottle enthusiasts in general. ~Jim


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## bottlenutboy (Mar 7, 2007)

well i for one would be more than happy to support the auctions as often and as much possible....but i dont get alot of money too often so any and all contributions i made would be miniscule in comparison to the ones made by others and of course the amount needed to keep something like that running.....if you guys get that going i will completely cut out Ebay all together and do any and all transactions through you guys so as to help with running costs i have been meaning to do some forum auctions but i dont have anything i want to lose yet that anyone would want


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## GuntherHess (Mar 7, 2007)

I will always support any effort like that but for me it cant really take the place of ebay. The problem is many of the bottles I sale are not bought by bottle collectors and many of the bottles I buy on ebay are not sold by bottle collectors. Its the huge mass of buyers and sellers that makes ebay the #1 market. It makes the selection huge and selling prices on rare stuff high. Its the 100 million people cleaning out there attics that make the oddball items show up that you dont see anywhere else. More bottle auction sites are good but i dont think they are going to replace the bottle category on ebay. Maybe I'm just being pessimistic[&o].


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## mrbottles (Mar 7, 2007)

Hi Chris,

 I am all on the minimalism.  I want to make something FOR bottle collectors rather than at their expense.  The cost has to be low for users and the site has to be secure and in non stop working order.  The part that we are concentrating on developing perfectly is the account history and user rating system.  No software out there now does much with the ability to really track what has happened in the past in relation to open honest use.  For example; in the light of stopping shill bidding we are going to have a preferred bidder listing.  Bidding on multiple different listing even without winning will result in users being listed as preferred bidders with auction titles exposed indefinitely.  (Just so people know)  We plan not to allow two registrations to the same person.  (More difficult that you might think)  I plan to allow open communication between users.  If some one wants to cheat and beg to close auction that will be their choice.  It will be against the rules and doing so would have destructive consequence for the user so it would be better for them not to.   For fees I am trying to figure out the ongoing cost accurately not what people will tolerate and pay.  My company has built and host hundreds/thousands of sites all with custom functionality and requirements.  We are the best web development company in the Milwaukee area.

 Here is the real kicker.  I may or may not be in this.  I want to run at a break even point.  That means no money above operating cost.  If there are 5,000 auctions a month a flat rate fee of $1 may be more than is necessary to charge.  That is with no licensing expense and trying to run in web servers that host no less than hundreds of other large data base sites.  If your numbers are close and we allow people to load large page view images so you can really see what you are trying to buy bandwidth will quickly become an issue.  Storage space is relatively inexpensive but histories and accounts will need to keep pieces of data for a long time to make a national bottle auction site good enough that people will get in and stay in.  We are looking at what an annual membership fee with no charges might equal in cost.  If the site gets going and there are 2000 users there is a real chance that a $10 flat rate annual fee could be more than enough to keep the site self sufficient forever.  You canâ€™t list and sell one bottle that hits $100 for less than nearly $10 on ebay.  

 I know a network of influential collectors willing to support the right solution so this has a chance.  If you look at what the nationally big dog collectors/auctioneers have done it is always for service of the bottle community but more than that it is for income.  That is okay BUT a better solution is collector based.  

 I plan to limit the scope of what we are developing to bottles or very closely related memorabilia.  Once the marbles and arrowheads are in it isnâ€™t a bottle site anymore.  I met with three programmers at work Monday.  One gave me a requirements doc for the back end functionality he thinks is required.  I being the only bottle dude here (Iâ€™m working on them every Christmas everyone gets at least one bottle) have a collector perspective that has to be considered. 

 Features will include

 Anti snipe- A bid inside the last fifteen minutes adds fifteen minutes to the auction

 Cover cost fees FLAT RATE if at all possible.  As the site grows this may equate to a yearly registration and no other fees.  Can you imagine free access with no charges to selling?  

 Restriction of sales to bottles and closely related memorabilia only.  

 And much more.  

 Steven


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## mrbottles (Mar 7, 2007)

Hi Matt,

 One of the things my company specialized in is being found in search engines.  It will take time but if we get off the ground people will eventually figure it out.  If it is non profit we may be able to get to the point that no matter who you try to contact when you type in a bottle name they will push you to the auction site.  

 I have no intention of replacing ebay you will still have to check in every now and then.  As a whole it will be a lot less costly and a lot better for bottle collectors to use the bottle auction site.  

 Steven


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## Mztress (Mar 7, 2007)

I know that I am a newbie here but the only time I use the no see bidder's option is when I put up cast iron.  My husband belongs to the WAGS forum for cast iron.  The guys on there pay sometimes hunderds  and sometimes thousands of dollars for one piece.  They prefer not being able to see the bidder.  They think that someone can't come after them or find out where they live.  Some of the guys on the forum have over 4-5 thousand pieces of cast iron.  But they all post on the forum and look out for each other.  They have also somehow, had items taken off because they were fakes.  I am not sure how they do it, but they have a whole forum for this purpose.  They will post the person's eBay name and also which ones they have had eBay take off.  

 I agree that for most times I don't like it and I agree that eBay's fees are getting to be way too much.  I sell on eBay but only what I want to get rid of and don't have a lot of money in.  I hate having yard sales and with my health I can't do all that so sitting at the computer is a lot easier.  If you get another site put up, please let me know.  I am in and willing to help where I can.

 Crysta


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## Bottleman (Mar 7, 2007)

GuntherHess, I think you made a really good point in your last post. I have bought some really nice bottles off ebay in the past that were found in basements and attics and the seller had no clue as to even what bottle category to put them under. So I will always keep checking ebay for those deals that sometimes pop up. I also sometimes sell common bottles that a collector might only pay $5-$15 for but a non-bottle collector on ebay might pay $20-$30 just because they like it and want to put it in their window. I support you 100% Chris and I think that would be a great idea as long as you get the word out and collectors check your auction site just as much as they do ebay. 

~~Tom[/b]


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## mrbottles (Mar 7, 2007)

Hey bottle collectors.  I am gathering opinions and information with the goal of building an antique bottle auction site that has minimal fees and maximum functionality combined with complete transparency. 

 Take a look and if you can please contribute; http://www.mrbottles.com/auctionsurvey.asp 

 Steven


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## Digger George (Mar 18, 2007)

Hey Chris I'm totally in! I've often thought about a bottle auction website too and it's a very good idea. You seem like you know what your talking about and I think your the person that can pull this off. You have to start somewhere.


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## NYCFlasks (Mar 21, 2007)

I had noticed this new wrinkle in eBay, when the auction gets over, I think 50 dollars, it becomes Bidder 1, Bidder 2 and so on.  Not happy here either with this either.
 I have seen some serious shilling over the years on eBay, and filed some complaints, most recently someone selling 8 differant items, in 8 seperate auctions.  Funny thing, the same underbidder bid the same amount in each auction, with each bid placed about 20-30 seconds apart. If that ain't shilling I do not know what is....
 With this Bidder 1, Bidder 2 thing, how can you check on what is going on?  This would seem to invite greater abuse, as this format does provide more of a smokescreen than before.
 While I do not like it, perhaps the only way around this situation is sniping.  Bidding with just seconds left does make it harder for the game players to play games!


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